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So attendances are down or to paraphrase "somewhat down" this year for our GAA matches.
But its the weather even though i would say myself that the weather is no different than a normal Irish summer.
Then there was the Euros, 2 of irelands 4 games were on a monday and thursday, one was on at 2pm on a saturday with i think maybe 3 qualifier games affected, the other on a sunday with 2 games in Croke park moved to accomodate the Ireland euro game against France.
The term "somewhat down" lends me to believe its not and insignificant drop and i dont believe the timing of the euros game had that much affect at all seeing as the main games that were on the 18th and 26th of June didnt clash at all with the Euros.
Could it be that people are just not attending games in the same numbers because whats being served up is simply not as enjoyable as it was in both codes despite the protestation by some that we are looking at intriguing tactical chess battles that the ordinary punter just doesnt understand!
Wait, whats that in the corner of the room, couldnt be an elephant could it?
tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1333 - 27/07/2016 10:17:15
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Replying To tearintom: "So attendances are down or to paraphrase "somewhat down" this year for our GAA matches.
But its the weather even though i would say myself that the weather is no different than a normal Irish summer.
Then there was the Euros, 2 of irelands 4 games were on a monday and thursday, one was on at 2pm on a saturday with i think maybe 3 qualifier games affected, the other on a sunday with 2 games in Croke park moved to accomodate the Ireland euro game against France.
The term "somewhat down" lends me to believe its not and insignificant drop and i dont believe the timing of the euros game had that much affect at all seeing as the main games that were on the 18th and 26th of June didnt clash at all with the Euros.
Could it be that people are just not attending games in the same numbers because whats being served up is simply not as enjoyable as it was in both codes despite the protestation by some that we are looking at intriguing tactical chess battles that the ordinary punter just doesnt understand!
Wait, whats that in the corner of the room, couldnt be an elephant could it?" It could also be down to the fact that both Leinster Finals were almost certain to be the "same old same old" and the Munster football final did not feature Cork . My family have 3 Premium seats between us in Croke Park. We literally could not give them away and I mean give them away for either Leinster final . People were not prepared to pay the train fare to go and see what they felt were entirely predictable games . That has nothing to do with the way the games are being played . It has all to do with the lack of competition. Clones was filled to capacity for the Ulster Final. That final was the epitome of all you profess distaste and disdain for . People want competition and contests . Last year's figures show an increase in attendances in Ulster for the fifth successive season . This is the province which has seen attendances of up to 10,000 for McKenna Cup Finals. I think you have seen what you want to see in terms of attendances and have gleefully attributed that to your theory of how the game is played . That is a little simplistic and you need to create time for a little more mature reflection . Wucklowman harked back to a time when midfielders were midfielders and the game was played "as it should be played". Maybe both of you should look at the attendance figures and scores for All Ireland semi finals and finals in the late seventies and early eighties .
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 27/07/2016 11:33:22
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Replying To Greengrass: "It could also be down to the fact that both Leinster Finals were almost certain to be the "same old same old" and the Munster football final did not feature Cork . My family have 3 Premium seats between us in Croke Park. We literally could not give them away and I mean give them away for either Leinster final . People were not prepared to pay the train fare to go and see what they felt were entirely predictable games . That has nothing to do with the way the games are being played . It has all to do with the lack of competition. Clones was filled to capacity for the Ulster Final. That final was the epitome of all you profess distaste and disdain for . People want competition and contests . Last year's figures show an increase in attendances in Ulster for the fifth successive season . This is the province which has seen attendances of up to 10,000 for McKenna Cup Finals. I think you have seen what you want to see in terms of attendances and have gleefully attributed that to your theory of how the game is played . That is a little simplistic and you need to create time for a little more mature reflection . Wucklowman harked back to a time when midfielders were midfielders and the game was played "as it should be played". Maybe both of you should look at the attendance figures and scores for All Ireland semi finals and finals in the late seventies and early eighties ." Great reply!!
Wally (Tyrone) - Posts: 912 - 27/07/2016 12:24:24
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Replying To Greengrass: "It could also be down to the fact that both Leinster Finals were almost certain to be the "same old same old" and the Munster football final did not feature Cork . My family have 3 Premium seats between us in Croke Park. We literally could not give them away and I mean give them away for either Leinster final . People were not prepared to pay the train fare to go and see what they felt were entirely predictable games . That has nothing to do with the way the games are being played . It has all to do with the lack of competition. Clones was filled to capacity for the Ulster Final. That final was the epitome of all you profess distaste and disdain for . People want competition and contests . Last year's figures show an increase in attendances in Ulster for the fifth successive season . This is the province which has seen attendances of up to 10,000 for McKenna Cup Finals. I think you have seen what you want to see in terms of attendances and have gleefully attributed that to your theory of how the game is played . That is a little simplistic and you need to create time for a little more mature reflection . Wucklowman harked back to a time when midfielders were midfielders and the game was played "as it should be played". Maybe both of you should look at the attendance figures and scores for All Ireland semi finals and finals in the late seventies and early eighties ." Kick-ass Greengrass!
himachechy (Donegal) - Posts: 293 - 27/07/2016 14:45:43
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Replying To Greengrass: "It could also be down to the fact that both Leinster Finals were almost certain to be the "same old same old" and the Munster football final did not feature Cork . My family have 3 Premium seats between us in Croke Park. We literally could not give them away and I mean give them away for either Leinster final . People were not prepared to pay the train fare to go and see what they felt were entirely predictable games . That has nothing to do with the way the games are being played . It has all to do with the lack of competition. Clones was filled to capacity for the Ulster Final. That final was the epitome of all you profess distaste and disdain for . People want competition and contests . Last year's figures show an increase in attendances in Ulster for the fifth successive season . This is the province which has seen attendances of up to 10,000 for McKenna Cup Finals. I think you have seen what you want to see in terms of attendances and have gleefully attributed that to your theory of how the game is played . That is a little simplistic and you need to create time for a little more mature reflection . Wucklowman harked back to a time when midfielders were midfielders and the game was played "as it should be played". Maybe both of you should look at the attendance figures and scores for All Ireland semi finals and finals in the late seventies and early eighties ." I agree that the level of competition is a huge problem.
But in saying that Clones was full to capacity is an indication is some form of proof that dropping attendances has nothing to do with how the game is being played is also rather simplistic dont you think seeing as the same game you claimed that people wouldnt buy a train fare to see would have filled Clones with 10k plus to spare. Lets be honest Clones will always be full on Ulster final day.
Again you quote last years figures when the thread in question dealing with this drop in attendances this year so im not sure what reference last years figures have.
Also im not sure why your referencing scoring and attendances in the 70's and early 80's, ive never attested to that being the way the game should be played at any stage, in fact i wouldnt have memories of games in those times due to my age but again saying attendances and scores were low in the 70's and early 80's really has no relevance to dropping attendances in 2016.
I agree about the competition being a huge contributing factor to lowering of attendances but again i feel the level of entertainment doled up on a regular basis in both codes this year has also been a telling factor. You obviously dont which is fair enough but just as a finishing point the level of competition has not really seen a huge adjustment from 2015 to 2016 in either code yet attendances are down!
Whatever the merits in why both of us think that may be, im pretty sure we can agree its nothing to do with the weather or the euros!
tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1333 - 27/07/2016 14:47:38
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Replying To Greengrass: "It could also be down to the fact that both Leinster Finals were almost certain to be the "same old same old" and the Munster football final did not feature Cork . My family have 3 Premium seats between us in Croke Park. We literally could not give them away and I mean give them away for either Leinster final . People were not prepared to pay the train fare to go and see what they felt were entirely predictable games . That has nothing to do with the way the games are being played . It has all to do with the lack of competition. Clones was filled to capacity for the Ulster Final. That final was the epitome of all you profess distaste and disdain for . People want competition and contests . Last year's figures show an increase in attendances in Ulster for the fifth successive season . This is the province which has seen attendances of up to 10,000 for McKenna Cup Finals. I think you have seen what you want to see in terms of attendances and have gleefully attributed that to your theory of how the game is played . That is a little simplistic and you need to create time for a little more mature reflection . Wucklowman harked back to a time when midfielders were midfielders and the game was played "as it should be played". Maybe both of you should look at the attendance figures and scores for All Ireland semi finals and finals in the late seventies and early eighties ." imagine applying common sense greengrass instead of dealing in hyperbole!
alano12 (Dublin) - Posts: 2208 - 27/07/2016 14:52:17
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Replying To tearintom: "I agree that the level of competition is a huge problem.
But in saying that Clones was full to capacity is an indication is some form of proof that dropping attendances has nothing to do with how the game is being played is also rather simplistic dont you think seeing as the same game you claimed that people wouldnt buy a train fare to see would have filled Clones with 10k plus to spare. Lets be honest Clones will always be full on Ulster final day.
Again you quote last years figures when the thread in question dealing with this drop in attendances this year so im not sure what reference last years figures have.
Also im not sure why your referencing scoring and attendances in the 70's and early 80's, ive never attested to that being the way the game should be played at any stage, in fact i wouldnt have memories of games in those times due to my age but again saying attendances and scores were low in the 70's and early 80's really has no relevance to dropping attendances in 2016.
I agree about the competition being a huge contributing factor to lowering of attendances but again i feel the level of entertainment doled up on a regular basis in both codes this year has also been a telling factor. You obviously dont which is fair enough but just as a finishing point the level of competition has not really seen a huge adjustment from 2015 to 2016 in either code yet attendances are down!
Whatever the merits in why both of us think that may be, im pretty sure we can agree its nothing to do with the weather or the euros!" You ask a good question but why do you bother asking if you're not willing to listen to other posters opinions without criticising them.
Football and hurling are sports where teams battle it out to win. They don't come under the entertainment banner. It's the championship of Ireland not The Voice of Ireland. Not everyone likes watching high scoring games with poor defences. Not everyone likes defensive games either. Myself, I would pick the intensity of this years Ulster Final over the hidings dished out in Ulster, Leinster and Connacht finals, even if some sides played sexy football.
But I agree that improvements can be made. Supporters will stay away more if they believe their team has no chance rather than if they play boring football that gives them a fair chance of winning. They need to try and narrow the gap between lower level counties and so-called bigger counties. Not sure how really but promising 2 games a summer won't do it. I think they should restructure the league so that existing division 3 and 4 teams are mixed in with divisions 1 and 2 to provide a long term improvement in standards. Not an easy thing to arrange.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7342 - 27/07/2016 15:42:16
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I did a thread recently National - Gaa attendances compared to the 90s
this was before we got 26000 for munster hurling final xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
As you have all noticed attendance in last few years have been well down really hit me last few years when munster championship semis been getting around 20-25000. Compared this to the 90s when practically everywhere was full houses. Been wondering through various potential reasons for this and would be interested in other opinions/other reasons
--Price -generally GAA do good on this, occasionally the price may be slightly steep e.g. €30 for covered stand for limerick tipp is bit steep leave it at €20, but generally they are good in this regard. Bear in mind at €80 the all ireland final sells out.
--Standard of play - may be an issue but I think the standard is still very high
--Tactics - blanket defences can be unattractive to watch, hurling going the same way, but then again if limerick won an all ireland with a blanket defence would anybody care
--Backdoor - first dip in attendances came when backdoor came in , clare v tipp in 2002 had around 25k at it, in 2001 in had close to 40k. Personally backdoor is not an issue for me but id say is an issue re early rounds
--Other sports- pro rugby wasnt a competitor in 90s, and in the main the sports dont clash - so not an issue for me
--Monotony - a big issue recently- in football in connacht and leinster its predictable whos going to win it -qfinals predictable as well, in hurling tis sometimes nearly a foregone conclusion kilkenny are going to win, munster football - its alway cork v kerry in the final. Big issue I would say. Wasnt like that in the nineties twas way more open and dubs andcats were the same as the rest of us.
Counties not having best players -issue in some counties but never in the big ones
--Has love of game died out -dont think so in fact i think GAA is as stong as ever
--Bandwagon element- big issue there is no longer a culture of having to be there at the game or feeling you are going to be the only one left in the country, happens in all sports
--culture - in the 90s a championship game was a day out starting in pub early and finishig late - now lots of people me included - just go to the game and come straight home
--Travel cost - is an issue -not GAAs fault of course
--Television -while there was live coverage in90s but I think people are now used to watching their team at home and are more likely now to watch it at home.
--Maybe the nineties was a one off boomtime - celtic tiger, more competitive, etc
To give some examples in remember a meath v kildare football and meath v offaly double header getting 48000 , in 1997 longford v offaly got around 18000
janesboro (Limerick) - Posts:473 - 10/06/2016 09:39:07
janesboro (Limerick) - Posts: 1502 - 27/07/2016 15:59:12
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this was posted in response in the other thread - good answer (my thread was before tipp beat cork in football)
2 biggest reasons in my eyes are
1. TV ..in the 90s the All ireland semi finals were all you would see now every match is on some channel
2. Money, peoples spending power is low, while many are in average paid jobs , many now have Mobile Phones & sky TV bills they never had in the 90s and instead had that cash to go to thurles or Pair Ui Chaoimh for the day out.
On another note when inter county footballers are saying they are not there to provide entertainment is it any wonder attendances are down.the attendance of 2734 at Tipp V Cork has to be a huge concern.
hurler32 (Limerick) - Posts:674 - 12/06/2016 21:43:15
janesboro (Limerick) - Posts: 1502 - 27/07/2016 15:59:56
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Replying To tearintom: "I agree that the level of competition is a huge problem.
But in saying that Clones was full to capacity is an indication is some form of proof that dropping attendances has nothing to do with how the game is being played is also rather simplistic dont you think seeing as the same game you claimed that people wouldnt buy a train fare to see would have filled Clones with 10k plus to spare. Lets be honest Clones will always be full on Ulster final day.
Again you quote last years figures when the thread in question dealing with this drop in attendances this year so im not sure what reference last years figures have.
Also im not sure why your referencing scoring and attendances in the 70's and early 80's, ive never attested to that being the way the game should be played at any stage, in fact i wouldnt have memories of games in those times due to my age but again saying attendances and scores were low in the 70's and early 80's really has no relevance to dropping attendances in 2016.
I agree about the competition being a huge contributing factor to lowering of attendances but again i feel the level of entertainment doled up on a regular basis in both codes this year has also been a telling factor. You obviously dont which is fair enough but just as a finishing point the level of competition has not really seen a huge adjustment from 2015 to 2016 in either code yet attendances are down!
Whatever the merits in why both of us think that may be, im pretty sure we can agree its nothing to do with the weather or the euros!" cork v kerry in munster is a lot different to kerry and tipp...and the leinster final was a foregone conclusion..people want to see teams competitive where they have a reasonable chance of winning..the ulster championship still means something to the teams involved
alano12 (Dublin) - Posts: 2208 - 27/07/2016 16:02:15
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Children aren't so interested in live sport.
When I was young going to the game was a real family day out.
Both parents and my sister. Neither of the girls gave 2 tosses about football most of the time but it was part of what you did every Summer. No GAA people would also be attending for the good day out aspect.
I think there is less of that with more distractions in the world.
A declining young population in rural Ireland doesn't help matters.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4215 - 27/07/2016 19:36:11
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Replying To GreenandRed: "You ask a good question but why do you bother asking if you're not willing to listen to other posters opinions without criticising them.
Football and hurling are sports where teams battle it out to win. They don't come under the entertainment banner. It's the championship of Ireland not The Voice of Ireland. Not everyone likes watching high scoring games with poor defences. Not everyone likes defensive games either. Myself, I would pick the intensity of this years Ulster Final over the hidings dished out in Ulster, Leinster and Connacht finals, even if some sides played sexy football.
But I agree that improvements can be made. Supporters will stay away more if they believe their team has no chance rather than if they play boring football that gives them a fair chance of winning. They need to try and narrow the gap between lower level counties and so-called bigger counties. Not sure how really but promising 2 games a summer won't do it. I think they should restructure the league so that existing division 3 and 4 teams are mixed in with divisions 1 and 2 to provide a long term improvement in standards. Not an easy thing to arrange." Great post.
waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13650 - 27/07/2016 19:53:40
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Replying To Whammo86: "Children aren't so interested in live sport.
When I was young going to the game was a real family day out.
Both parents and my sister. Neither of the girls gave 2 tosses about football most of the time but it was part of what you did every Summer. No GAA people would also be attending for the good day out aspect.
I think there is less of that with more distractions in the world.
A declining young population in rural Ireland doesn't help matters." Is this the most boring thread ever on HS?
liner (Mayo) - Posts: 756 - 27/07/2016 20:02:46
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There's always a good championship buzz going to games. Some at work are bringing their kids 8-12 year olds who are loving going to the games.
The qualifiers created a new vibrance for a while that has faded away. The 4 qualifying rounds are a bit much in my own opinion.
Either a separate All-Ireland championship from the provincials or a compromise of a Round of 16 consisting of 8 provincial finalists and 8 Q2 winners should come in place of the current setup.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7838 - 27/07/2016 20:49:36
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Replying To liner: "Is this the most boring thread ever on HS?" Who knows?
Nearly all the posters on it have at least contributed their opinions. Except yourself.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7342 - 27/07/2016 22:08:28
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Replying To Greengrass: "It could also be down to the fact that both Leinster Finals were almost certain to be the "same old same old" and the Munster football final did not feature Cork . My family have 3 Premium seats between us in Croke Park. We literally could not give them away and I mean give them away for either Leinster final . People were not prepared to pay the train fare to go and see what they felt were entirely predictable games . That has nothing to do with the way the games are being played . It has all to do with the lack of competition. Clones was filled to capacity for the Ulster Final. That final was the epitome of all you profess distaste and disdain for . People want competition and contests . Last year's figures show an increase in attendances in Ulster for the fifth successive season . This is the province which has seen attendances of up to 10,000 for McKenna Cup Finals. I think you have seen what you want to see in terms of attendances and have gleefully attributed that to your theory of how the game is played . That is a little simplistic and you need to create time for a little more mature reflection . Wucklowman harked back to a time when midfielders were midfielders and the game was played "as it should be played". Maybe both of you should look at the attendance figures and scores for All Ireland semi finals and finals in the late seventies and early eighties ." Tell that elephant to move over and make room for the ostrich
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2141 - 28/07/2016 09:30:05
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Replying To GreenandRed: "Who knows?
Nearly all the posters on it have at least contributed their opinions. Except yourself." Nearly all, except myself???
Once again u fail to make sense .
liner (Mayo) - Posts: 756 - 28/07/2016 13:19:36
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Replying To liner: "Nearly all, except myself???
Once again u fail to make sense ." I'm making perfect sense. You're just stirring.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7342 - 28/07/2016 15:09:52
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Replying To GreenandRed: "I'm making perfect sense. You're just stirring." OK , nearly all except (e.g. ) myself and green and red.
Get It? Good!!
liner (Mayo) - Posts: 756 - 28/07/2016 18:17:51
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