I would not be a great follower of soccer but wanting to see Leicester winning the title I watched a few games lately
One was Spurs v Chelsea. Now that was a fairly robust game to say the least. What really struck me was the ref and his dealing with rough/ dangerous play. He did not hesitate to give a card and I'd say he was spot on with all the cards he gave.
How would he have fared in Tralee back a few months ago Donegal v Kerry. ?
Watching the game I began to wonder are the GAA refs lenient, are they afraid to produce too many cards , would it help or hinder if there was a bit of a clampdown on cynical or rough or dirty play?
Also incidents caught on camera and not seen by the ref in that game were dealt with, straight away may I add and proper suspensions handed down I think Spurs had two players suspended for (a) 3 games and(b) 6 games
Now if that happened in the GAA there would be uproar. What went on over the last few years with disciplinary issues in the GAA was laughable.
Have we got a committee overseeing discipline who are capable of acting and doing the right thing not jumping the gun as for an example --- Tiernan McCann affair
Any player caught off the ball IMO should have the book thrown at him , let him have a fair hearing but if guilty let him play the penalty.
Take the last two years for example and the number of players who walked Scot free when in reality the should have served a suspension.
Your opinions please

SamOnErrigal (Donegal) - Posts: 1427 - 10/05/2016 09:57:57    1853478

For me there is a fundamental difference when discussing soccer and GAA , our players train and are not paid there is little enough games as it is without suspending willy nilly ie letter of law etc Remember how many games there are in a soccer season and ask yourself is a two three match ban the biggest deal in the world . you bet its a big deal in GAA.
Its keeping fellas playing which is difficult enough as it is

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 10/05/2016 10:44:01    1853503

The GAA discipline is a absolute farce at the moment. GAA doesn't take discipline serious enough allowing players red cards to be overturned so easily. Philip McMahon 1 game suspension for Donaghy was a joke. Should have got 6 months. The new thing I yet to see GAA cut down is choking /grabbing players around the neck. A number Dublin players have been targeted with opposition players grabbing players by the throat. Referees take easy option and book 2 players involved in the incident.

Gael85 (Dublin) - Posts: 1433 - 10/05/2016 10:44:48    1853505

Fully agree. But the problem comes from the top down. In the same game you references there was an eye gouging incident Straight away it was deemed a more serious offence than the standard ban and the guy got 6 games as opposed to 3. In the gaa we get the exact same thing and the ban handed out is the standard 1 match ban. Therein lies the problem - we don't address serious issues like this properly.

We could learn a lot from soccer as regards addressing things like dangerous behaviour and frivolous appeals.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 10/05/2016 11:10:45    1853515

Interesting topic.
I think some things are more serious and need to be clamped down on in the GAA.

The CCCCCCCCCCCCCCC and others are absolutely useless. Everything takes several days to get sorted and in probably 80% of cases the wrong decision is given.

Eamon McGee got sent off for Gweedore one game and got a ban. He reckoned it was the first time he was innocent and the first time he couldn't try to appeal (or the story was something like that)

The strange thing is that in some scenarios where an offender is provoked the offender gets off. The should never be the case the provoker should get a ban but the offender should also have to answer for his actions. Goading and provoking is a massive issue now. See any star player and then special attention they receive especially should they be on a yellow card.

In the GAA I feel a better appeals process needs to be introduced and also any county/player who appeals wrongly (in scenarios where they are guilty) then additional bans and fines should be introduced.

Say what you want about the season being short and whatever but in every county there are loads of lads dying to wear that jersey. If the player does the crime the should accept the penalty given.

dstuction (Donegal) - Posts: 1209 - 10/05/2016 11:47:38    1853533

For some fairness and balance in this discussion, when that soccer game was reviewed the next day ex-referees agreed that it was a very poor refereeing performance by the professional referee, and that as well as the player subsequently suspended at least 2 more players should also have been red-carded. However they all agreed also that the main fault lay with the players and their behaviour. Compare that to the GAA where players are often excused for their behaviour and the brunt of the blame is put on the amateur referee, often in games more difficult to control than that soccer game. The system of bans and appeals in GAA is woeful, but in my opinion the referees are not near as bad as some make out.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 10/05/2016 11:49:43    1853534

Damo, you could still have bans enforced, relative to the number of games played. For example, a gouge in soccer could be 6 games, but it could be 3 in the gaa. The crux of the issue is we are handing out one game, i.e. the same ban for that as a normal red card offence. The result of this is increasingly outlandish behaviour becoming more mainstream, as there is no proper punishment to discourage it.

It seems guys in power just don't want to address it. They seem to want to brush it under the rug, and counties are in turn walking all over them. Is it out of fear or whatever, Im not sure. But if the English FA can ban guys from man city, Chelsea, man utd etc, who have far more spending clout than county teams to mount any potential appeals etc, then I don't see why the gaa should be afraid to do the same.

Personally, I think part of the problem lies in the way the appeals process becomes more and more like a courtroom the further you go. At the end of the day, refs get calls wrong and you just have to get on with it. If a guy is banned, appeals and the ban stands, he should just have to get on with it too. Otherwise where does it end? It is a game at the end of the day and sometimes the break goes against you in a game. As long as everyone knows this at the start then nobody is being hard done by.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 10/05/2016 11:59:14    1853540

Sam that game was possible the worst reffed game of the year The ref blew it A number of players should have seen Red And he wouldn't fare to well in Tralee or any other GAA ground

cluichethar (Mayo) - Posts: 454 - 10/05/2016 12:11:49    1853549

Eden Hazard would need the brown jocks on if Keith Higgins was marking him!

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7344 - 10/05/2016 12:49:18    1853575

The post here about the provoked getting a card/ ban along with the offender is spot on.
Vert interesting comments on the eye gouging --- eg six game ban in Soccer but one in GAA
The thing is people on here ---- do we want to clean the game up a bit or at least seem to put in place rules / code of conduct that will punish players who break them or overstep the line.
I thought the black card should have been given a better chance by the referee 's , it should have served a purpose as untold number of players were either stopped or fouled when making a run yet offenders got away with it. Plus refs are not consistant and it was obvious the black card would not succeed as different refs seemed to give different interpretation of the rules re black cards, some gave yellow( probably a black) others gave black( probably a yellow)
We had a lot of controversity over the last few seasons , nothing seems to have been done about and I bet again this year we will have plenty of the same.

SamOnErrigal (Donegal) - Posts: 1427 - 10/05/2016 13:29:04    1853605

The Master I agree with most of what you are saying ,
Just to be clear I don't agree with the current process
I don't feel the exhaustive duration of appeals does the association any favours in a PR perspective
I do feel there should be a process an appeal and that's it move on
Equally I wouldn't be using the soccer system as a shining light either regards referring , this is a system were regularly bigger teams get the rub of the green constantly over smaller clubs

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 10/05/2016 13:36:01    1853608

The disciplinary system in the gaa is one of the last bastions of amateurism in an increasingly professional organisation. We've had instances in the last few years were decisions which have been made have left a sour taste in the mouth for many. There are few enough games and no one wants to see the best players sitting in the stand but surely if an offence has been committed then the punishment should be forthcoming.

I remember back in the day before the 89 hurling final one of our star players was sent of in one of the well publicised 'local derbies' for striking however when the suspension came around his cousin, same surname, was the one who took the fall. Unfortunately I don't think things have moved on a lot since then.

There are two things which would infinitely improve both football and hurling, a defined tackle, and a robust disciplinary procedure but this is the nettle the gaa will not grasp as it is my belief having this less than transparent system allows a significant amount of wiggle room which allows commercial and populist decisions to take precedence rather than consistent application of rules.

duckula20 (Antrim) - Posts: 175 - 10/05/2016 14:06:38    1853620

Damo, the very same rub of the green happens in the gaa in fairness. Guys get off for things in quarter and semi finals that others don't get off with. I offer the soccer system not as a perfect example, but as a far superior example to our own. The English FA commands respect from the clubs in its processes. The GAA on the other hand, do their best to appease the teams when placed under any media spotlight. It is as if they have no belief in their own convictions.

Id go as far to say that if you got people from the FA to watch last seasons football league and championship season from start to finish, they would be shocked at how it was officiated.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 10/05/2016 15:40:39    1853669

Damo, the very same rub of the green happens in the gaa in fairness. Guys get off for things in quarter and semi finals that others don't get off with. I offer the soccer system not as a perfect example, but as a far superior example to our own. The English FA commands respect from the clubs in its processes. The GAA on the other hand, do their best to appease the teams when placed under any media spotlight. It is as if they have no belief in their own convictions.

Id go as far to say that if you got people from the FA to watch last seasons football league and championship season from start to finish, they would be shocked at how it was officiated.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts:15560 - 10/05/2016 15:40:39 1853669

Lee Keegan red card for lashing out at Donnachadh Walsh in 2014 should have been rescinded. Same with Dermot Connolly in 2011 and last year

dbirdkyforsam16 (Kerry) - Posts: 56 - 10/05/2016 16:14:44    1853686

Damo, the very same rub of the green happens in the gaa in fairness. Guys get off for things in quarter and semi finals that others don't get off with. I offer the soccer system not as a perfect example, but as a far superior example to our own. The English FA commands respect from the clubs in its processes. The GAA on the other hand, do their best to appease the teams when placed under any media spotlight. It is as if they have no belief in their own convictions.

Id go as far to say that if you got people from the FA to watch last seasons football league and championship season from start to finish, they would be shocked at how it was officiated.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts:15560 - 10/05/2016 15:40:39 1853669

Lee Keegan red card for lashing out at Donnachadh Walsh in 2014 should have been rescinded. Same with Dermot Connolly in 2011 and last year

*never been rescinded

dbirdkyforsam16 (Kerry) - Posts: 56 - 10/05/2016 16:19:38    1853688

it is crazy when you see what some players get away with right under the noses of the ref . take for example Keiran Donaghy's neck pull-down on Michael Murphy during this years league match. no card, all the other shenanigans that went on that day with very few cards yet a completely innocuous "tackle" by Cavan's Liam Buchanan On a Tyrone player during the league 2 final warrants a black card. (these are just 2 examples that come to mins and I don't mean to single out Donaghy as getting away with stuff and Cavan as been hard done by. others can cite different examples.

s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5518 - 10/05/2016 16:32:55    1853697