Looking at the match yesterday, I couldnt help noticing how much it contrasted to Niall Quinn's claim that players dont dive. For me, there were players on both sides diving and looking for frees, with one particular Cork forward being absolutely blatant about it. I have noticed it during the league also and I honestly think diving is becoming rampant in hurling and let only the most deluded hurling supporter tell you otherwise.

Is this the direction hurling is now taking? Because for me, if this continues, be it a Wexford man or a Cork or a Kilkenny man doing it, it will completely turn me off the game.

Pinkie (Wexford) - Posts: 4100 - 26/05/2014 13:50:36    1593563

more interested in the cynical holding of the hurl yesterday
and throwing of the hurl considering the waterford player was already on a yellow card yet no mention of this on sunday game
or newspapers

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 26/05/2014 14:23:57    1593596

Care to name the forward?

RebelCork (Cork) - Posts: 789 - 26/05/2014 14:27:30    1593602

Cadogan dived for a free yesterday just before half time.

Diving has existed for quite a while any good conrer forward in football or hurling will be trying to draw contact from his marker and hit the deck to geta free its good corner forward play in my opinion.

uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts: 1296 - 26/05/2014 14:32:16    1593606

I agree with " uibhfhaili1986 " on the diving problem. The other activity of a player in possession swinging his hurley back and leaving it purposely trailing behind him to have the ref believe that its being held is now an art in itself and frees are given in every match for it.

Clubgaa (Limerick) - Posts: 879 - 26/05/2014 14:45:44    1593615

Spot on pinkie. Totally agree. Hurling is everybit as cynical as football. Howver, we are only supposed to criticise football. Hurling needs the black card as much as football does in my opinion.

bennybunny (Cork) - Posts: 3917 - 26/05/2014 17:29:56    1593750

Dead right. The only way to stop it is to punish it retrospectively. But then most of these tools deny it ever happens

flack (Dublin) - Posts: 1054 - 26/05/2014 17:44:54    1593764

Diving is a problem in every sport. We are well used to it in soccer, one of the worlds finest rugby players has had to apologise after diving in the European final on Saturday, and its a major source of scores for some counties in football. It just shows what a difficult job referees have, its hard enough refereeing a game as it is but when players deliberately try to cheat and con the referee it becomes impossible, regardless of what sport it is. It would be great to think that teammates would stamp it out but sadly this is unlikely with the win at all costs attitude. Its all the worse when you think that JBM would be one of the more sporting managers.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 26/05/2014 20:55:53    1593872

Agree entirely. Diving has crept into hurling in a big way in recent years. I'm glad somebody has highlighted this cynical act. And I don't agree that it has always been part of hurling, it hasn't. Kilkenny were accused of various misdeamors during their reign at the top but they could never be accused of diving. If more teams, including Kilkenny now join in this act then who can blame them if the others are getting away with? The other thing refs haven't been strict with is over carrying, it was rampant throughout last year right through to the Final replay.

westisthebest (Galway) - Posts: 444 - 26/05/2014 21:10:21    1593887

Agree entirely. Diving has crept into hurling in a big way in recent years. I'm glad somebody has highlighted this cynical act. And I don't agree that it has always been part of hurling, it hasn't. Kilkenny were accused of various misdeamors during their reign at the top but they could never be accused of diving. If more teams, including Kilkenny now join in this act then who can blame them if the others are getting away with? The other thing refs haven't been strict with is over carrying, it was rampant throughout last year right through to the Final replay.

westisthebest (Galway) - Posts: 444 - 26/05/2014 21:18:55    1593895

There's a fine line that needs to be enforced. Diving can't be tolerated obviously, but either can Kilkenny's carry on. Cahalane was called up for a perfect shoulder tackle yesterday yet Waterford got away with holding and throwing hurleys (not trying to just target Waterford). Time to decide whether we want a cynical game or a physical game. As long as you can get away with messing with hurleys etc. then why shouldn't you dive?

RebelCork (Cork) - Posts: 789 - 26/05/2014 21:28:43    1593904

Hurling doesn't get one tenth of the scrutiny football gets and when something is rarely highlighted the estbalished counties and commentators circle the wagons and give the same standard Mick the Bull answer from Savage Eye "Aaah now, 'tis a maaaaanns game and deees boys are not dirrrrrttty at all, dey all work de land and God bless them all".

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9697 - 26/05/2014 21:30:07    1593906

Is that the first attempt at defending diving in hurling? The other lot were grabbing our hurls so its only right that we should be allowed to dive? There were allegations of Cork diving last year anywhere around the 21 so they could bring Nash up to hit his free from 13 yards, yesterday was the first example where there could be no doubting that diving is an approach that some Cork hurlers have taken on (I am aware yesterdays diver was making his debut.) But you are right Rebel, the free in for the perfectly timed shoulder was another very disappointing decision for anyone who wants to see hurling continued to be played by men with honour, its about time that the benefit of the doubt was given to the guy landing the shoulder to allow this vital part of the game remain.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 26/05/2014 21:47:10    1593923

I don't think the hurling fraternity take a "see no evil, hear no evil, say no evil" stance. Its just mostly they couldn't care less, because they are two very different games. Tugging a hurley, is a very dangerous game, the answer is usually a baclslap, an it hurts! When players have a metre long lump of wood you have to be very careful who you wind up or annoy.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4895 - 26/05/2014 21:50:22    1593926

Well I doubt GAA officialdom will want to accept that all is not well in their hurling world after the best championship ever last year. But rules are rules and just because we have new champions and a more evenly balanced championship doesn't mean misdemeanours should be ignored. There is little point is saying it's ok to dive because some rule was broken in the oats. Now is now, and diving is diving, over carrying is over carrying.

westisthebest (Galway) - Posts: 444 - 26/05/2014 21:52:23    1593929

I'm not defending it, I'm saying physicality is being called as fouls but cynical play (diving, flinging hurleys, holding hurleys) is now grand. If you can't win/tackle properly now then why wouldn't you cheat?

RebelCork (Cork) - Posts: 789 - 26/05/2014 21:54:48    1593933

Soma
County: UK
Posts: 289

1593923
Is that the first attempt at defending diving in hurling? The other lot were grabbing our hurls so its only right that we should be allowed to dive? There were allegations of Cork diving last year anywhere around the 21 so they could bring Nash up to hit his free from 13 yards, yesterday was the first example where there could be no doubting that diving is an approach that some Cork hurlers have taken on (I am aware yesterdays diver was making his debut.) But you are right Rebel, the free in for the perfectly timed shoulder was another very disappointing decision for anyone who wants to see hurling continued to be played by men with honour, its about time that the benefit of the doubt was given to the guy landing the shoulder to allow this vital part of the game remain.

Absolutely spot on. Refs will have seen plenty of this diving during the last few years, it's getting more prevalent and therefore they must halt it by implementing the rules. Diving has become a core tactic of the Cork game and that along with the so called Nash style penalty while crucial to their success is simply cheating. We can see now the way the Nash penalty is spreading to other counties and the diving will follow - and why not if Cork are getting away with it.

It would appear that officials were so busy on stamping out physicality that they've neglected other infringements. Diving and over carrying has crept into hurling in a big way recently and needs to be addressed. Clare's over carrying doesn't justify Corks diving - both are fouls and should be blown even at the expense of wonderful open hurling!

westisthebest (Galway) - Posts: 444 - 27/05/2014 09:21:49    1593961

bennybunny
County: Cork
Posts: 2298

1593750 Spot on pinkie. Totally agree. Hurling is everybit as cynical as football. Howver, we are only supposed to criticise football. Hurling needs the black card as much as football does in my opinion.


Thank God as I thought I was the only one who was of this opinion in Cork. Had a debate about this in the local recently and I was of the opinion that the black card is needed in hurling. The 'other side' were of the opinion that they were two different games and hurling doesn't need a black card as pulling and dragging does not happen.

In that case what is there to fear so?

batterburger (Cork) - Posts: 161 - 27/05/2014 10:08:03    1593982

west the one thing I would be careful about is blaming referees for any diving. Any diving that takes place is the fault completely of the cheat himself, and to some extent his teammates and managers who don't tell him to cop on and respect the jersey he is wearing. The purpose of it is to con the referee, it is hard then to blame the referee for being fooled by it as some of those doing it no doubt spend a bit of time practicing. You would wonder would people be ok to see their county jersey being worn by people who intentionally dive as long as it gives them a better chance of silverware? I would say that it seems some would be happy about this, and that is where the problem is. Diving is completely different to most other misdemeanours in my opinion because it requires a completely different mindset, it doesn't just accidentally happen but instead you must go out looking for the opportunity to do it.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 27/05/2014 10:19:11    1593986

27/05/2014 10:08:03
batterburger
County: Cork
Posts: 96

1593982
bennybunny
County: Cork
Posts: 2298

1593750 Spot on pinkie. Totally agree. Hurling is everybit as cynical as football. Howver, we are only supposed to criticise football. Hurling needs the black card as much as football does in my opinion.


Thank God as I thought I was the only one who was of this opinion in Cork. Had a debate about this in the local recently and I was of the opinion that the black card is needed in hurling. The 'other side' were of the opinion that they were two different games and hurling doesn't need a black card as pulling and dragging does not happen.

In that case what is there to fear so?

Whats is there to fear oh let me think , how about a ref who cant tell a yellow from a black , a caution from a yellow , a black and a yellow equal no sending off ,refs currently making a pigs ear of one code and now you want it in hurling !
Fact they are two different codes speed of ball moving making it very difficult to officiate hurling , the rules in place are sufficient theres just not enough ref,s capable of keeping up with speed of play to apply the rules , time the number of ref,s lines mans role are looked into , but a black card get it sorted in one code before you double the problem by screwing up a second .

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 27/05/2014 10:28:13    1593996