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Dublin V Tyrone

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Replying To clondalkindub:  "It was reckless and dangerous from Morgan and should of been a straight red card but I don't believe he meant to break Paddy's jaw."
From looking at it on TV, he is going in got the shoulder, unfortunately for Paddy the timing was slightly off. It was very marginal as well.

For to be considered reckless and dangerous Morgan has to lead with his elbow which he did not. His elbow is no where near a dangerous. That is the difference between this incident and the Kennelly incident mentioned in other comments. Kennelly lifted his elbow to connect.

Nobody wants to see anyone get injured, but unfortunately this things do happen from time to time. Incidents cannot be judged by the outcome, by if someone gets injured. You need to look at the full picture of what happened.

juicy (Meath) - Posts: 399 - 19/03/2019 10:48:52    2173633

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Replying To juicy:  "From looking at it on TV, he is going in got the shoulder, unfortunately for Paddy the timing was slightly off. It was very marginal as well.

For to be considered reckless and dangerous Morgan has to lead with his elbow which he did not. His elbow is no where near a dangerous. That is the difference between this incident and the Kennelly incident mentioned in other comments. Kennelly lifted his elbow to connect.

Nobody wants to see anyone get injured, but unfortunately this things do happen from time to time. Incidents cannot be judged by the outcome, by if someone gets injured. You need to look at the full picture of what happened."
His elbow can only be considered dangerous? What are you on about ? So a high shoulder into a mans jaw is not dangerous? Don't be silly Now.

clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9926 - 19/03/2019 11:55:51    2173654

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Replying To AthCliath:  "


You mean like Offaly."
Wiered thing, if we didn't manage to do five in a row i think i would consider Donegal our Offaly.

Best wishes to Paddys Andrews in his recovery.

We will learn from that and move on.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 19/03/2019 11:59:20    2173656

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Replying To clondalkindub:  "His elbow can only be considered dangerous? What are you on about ? So a high shoulder into a mans jaw is not dangerous? Don't be silly Now."
When coming from the side then yes. As I said, it was a collision in which was unfortunate to see someone injured.

It is a contact game after all. If ppl cant handle it then they prob need to start watching badminton or something like that.

juicy (Meath) - Posts: 399 - 19/03/2019 12:22:29    2173665

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I always find it amusing that people watch a game, see an incident and then go on like they have a degree in body positioning and are able to read minds of players when they've seen a flashpoint incident from a good bit away in real time and/or watch it in slow motion about 100 times on tele and come to their own conclusion that player X DEFINITELY went to hurt player Y.

Here's the thing. The only person who knows for certain whether he meant to hurt Paddy Andrews, is Morgan himself and im confident that he didn't mean to hurt him. He has since come out on twitter and said he is sorry to hear about Paddy and has been in contact with him since, so that's it. Nothing else to see here.

Its a contact sport. There are hits, nowhere near as many tough hard hits as there was in the 70s and 80s its lame now in comparison, it was just one of those things, Ive seen and will see in future plenty of Dublin players letting their men know they are around, its part and parcel of the game, Doesn't mean they intend to hurt anyone, id be inclined to just take Niall Morgans hit on the chin excuse the pun.


Reckless ? A little. Late ? A little. but you can be late and reckless, doesn't mean youre purposely trying to break someones jaw.

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13650 - 19/03/2019 12:29:31    2173670

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Replying To waynoI:  "I always find it amusing that people watch a game, see an incident and then go on like they have a degree in body positioning and are able to read minds of players when they've seen a flashpoint incident from a good bit away in real time and/or watch it in slow motion about 100 times on tele and come to their own conclusion that player X DEFINITELY went to hurt player Y.

Here's the thing. The only person who knows for certain whether he meant to hurt Paddy Andrews, is Morgan himself and im confident that he didn't mean to hurt him. He has since come out on twitter and said he is sorry to hear about Paddy and has been in contact with him since, so that's it. Nothing else to see here.

Its a contact sport. There are hits, nowhere near as many tough hard hits as there was in the 70s and 80s its lame now in comparison, it was just one of those things, Ive seen and will see in future plenty of Dublin players letting their men know they are around, its part and parcel of the game, Doesn't mean they intend to hurt anyone, id be inclined to just take Niall Morgans hit on the chin excuse the pun.


Reckless ? A little. Late ? A little. but you can be late and reckless, doesn't mean youre purposely trying to break someones jaw."
In spirit i would tend to agree with you.

But i think its naive to suggest that these incidents dont have an outside narrative and an influence on games as they effect a players reputation.

Watching the Duff Loachra gael programme its crazy to think that he was banned for a year for something that could have seen in any league ground at the weekend, certainly every second. With not any injury to the player in question.

Equally Diarmuid Connolly anyone who watched him will know he isnt a dirty player, yet the lad was hounded out of the game because of outside media narratives influencing banning that had a direct impact on his life. A direct result of Pat Spillane having a song and dance.

I mention it because the reality is in spirit i think most lads and fans want to take their licks and get on with and that would be my approach to this.

At the game on Sat night i didnt anyone mention the incident after the game, its only become a thing now because Brolly and O Se whipped it up. That has a direct influence on Morgans reputation and decision making in similar incidents in the future. In Brolly words he has "history", that influences games in my opinion.

Similar to Dully back in the day and Connolly in the modern era, like it or not the media and the highlighting of these issues has a direct influence on players reputations, an impact on their personal lives and reputations. If they play on after a ban, it has a direct influence on the game and decisions either for or against them and cards.

Im not saying i agree with any of that, but its naive to think it doesn't, whatever we think from a sporting moral point of view.

Im using a couple of Dublin players as an example, but im sure other counties have similar tales of woe.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 19/03/2019 13:05:57    2173682

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "You make some great points there Llaw like you say teams are usually beat before they hit the pitch to play the dubs and when you look at the way Tyrone and Donegal and Roscommon approached the super 8 games against them last year the plan was to keep the score down and shoot out between eachother for the second spot, and that was understandable for last year but this year maybe team will take a bit of belief from Tyrone Kerry and Monaghan's victories over them and attack them.

Mikey Sheehy said when we were going for the 5 that they had done all the same preparation but that they all just felt flat ? Maybe just a lack of hunger or whatever.

Can you imagine the team that could stop the 5 would probably end up more famous than the team that did the 4"
That appears very harsh on Tyrone and Donegal last year. The Roscommon game was a dead rubber for both teams seeing as Roscommon couldn't qualify for the semi finals so that game can be largely discounted, though if their approach was to keep the score down then it certainly didn't appear that way when watching the game live.

Donegal were neck and neck with Dublin approaching half time and missed a very good goal chance. Dublin went straight down the other end and scored themselves. The second goal just after half time largely killed the game as a contest.

Similarly, Tyrone were very much in contention at half time in the Super 8 game, only being 2 points down and playing well. Dublin god a somewhat fortuitous goal shortly into the second half and it Tyrone very much forced the play from then until the end of the game but missed a few presentable chances to narrow the gap before Dublin sealed it in injury time.

None of these teams looked like their "plan was to keep the score down and shoot out between each other for the second spot" from my perspective. Perhaps my opinion on the matter is overly subjective but I don't think the teams in question lacked belief when facing the Dubs.

Kurt_Angle (Dublin) - Posts: 567 - 19/03/2019 14:30:59    2173706

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Will Dublin field a meaningful team against Cavan for the last league match?

Surely it is better for them to write off the league and give all the fringe players some game time. A bit of a kick around in Breffni Park, with zero interest in the result , would be a nice way to spend a Sunday

MadgeKing (Cavan) - Posts: 493 - 19/03/2019 14:48:37    2173711

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Replying To The_Fridge:  "Away back to the Hill 16 Army site with that crap. You will have an audience there.

Accidental crash. It happens. Feel for Paddy Andrews, good player, but these things happen in a contact sport. Hope he gets back to full fitness for championship"
What a load of utter nonsense , have you ever played the game ? he could have pulled out , it's obvious his only intention was to take out the man , had no hope of winning that ball it was reckless and dangerous end off, as for your silly hill 16 army jibe ! Really grow up .

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2837 - 19/03/2019 14:58:02    2173712

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Replying To MadgeKing:  "Will Dublin field a meaningful team against Cavan for the last league match?

Surely it is better for them to write off the league and give all the fringe players some game time. A bit of a kick around in Breffni Park, with zero interest in the result , would be a nice way to spend a Sunday"
Hard to know a chara, i think their will be a few novices for sure, but if i had to call it on Gavin's reaction after the game, he was furious, so i think there will be skin and hair flying this week in the land of heroes of renown this week. Any team fielded i think will be like a poked bear. So should be a good game with Cavan still having skin in the game.

Hoping to see Bernard Brogan get some pitch time myself.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 19/03/2019 15:14:51    2173717

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Replying To TheUsername:  "Hard to know a chara, i think their will be a few novices for sure, but if i had to call it on Gavin's reaction after the game, he was furious, so i think there will be skin and hair flying this week in the land of heroes of renown this week. Any team fielded i think will be like a poked bear. So should be a good game with Cavan still having skin in the game.

Hoping to see Bernard Brogan get some pitch time myself."
Senior I hope!
If Rossies and Kerry are level late on it could be some craic yet .. du-duh.... do day de du duh...deh deh de deh de deh de du duh.....

MadgeKing (Cavan) - Posts: 493 - 19/03/2019 15:30:50    2173721

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Replying To superbluedub:  "What a load of utter nonsense , have you ever played the game ? he could have pulled out , it's obvious his only intention was to take out the man , had no hope of winning that ball it was reckless and dangerous end off, as for your silly hill 16 army jibe ! Really grow up ."
I think your a bit biased here and if it was a Dublin player who did this you would have a different attitude.

So to say that someone who has no hope of winning the ball shouldn't go for it, says a lot about how you believe the game should be played. Andrews won the ball Morgan is coming a pace to win/tackle if he doesn't win it. This is not a case of somebody lining them up from a mile off and driving a should into them. This a case where Morgan is trying to get a shoulder in on him.

As both of these players are athletes Andrews makes a slight adjustment to his body as Morgan is coming in. This is what results in the contact being made to the head.

The reaction in the media will most likely lead to plenty of red cards next weekend as a result for incidents similar to this where thing are miss timed slightly.

Look if he wanted to do him, he would have led with his elbow and then it is reckless and dangerous. Accidents/collisions whatever you want to call it happen in games.

juicy (Meath) - Posts: 399 - 19/03/2019 16:36:16    2173738

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Replying To juicy:  "I think your a bit biased here and if it was a Dublin player who did this you would have a different attitude.

So to say that someone who has no hope of winning the ball shouldn't go for it, says a lot about how you believe the game should be played. Andrews won the ball Morgan is coming a pace to win/tackle if he doesn't win it. This is not a case of somebody lining them up from a mile off and driving a should into them. This a case where Morgan is trying to get a shoulder in on him.

As both of these players are athletes Andrews makes a slight adjustment to his body as Morgan is coming in. This is what results in the contact being made to the head.

The reaction in the media will most likely lead to plenty of red cards next weekend as a result for incidents similar to this where thing are miss timed slightly.

Look if he wanted to do him, he would have led with his elbow and then it is reckless and dangerous. Accidents/collisions whatever you want to call it happen in games."
I would be firmly in the camp of take your licking and move on.

But I was at the game and Tyrone were intent on revenge or putting down a marker or whatever, certain players were targeted for a licking and softening up, in my opinion. I don't have a problem with that it's up to the referee deal with it.

Fenton, Costello and Small were targeted. Two of whom went of injured and Fenton was lucky not to, but I dare say he was feeling like a second row the next day.

In Andrews case, Dublin got in behind the blanket and Paddy was in the corner and going to bear down on Morgan. Morgan came out to the corner, which was ridiculous as the last man! When he came he had to clean Paddy out, he had to take the man and concede the free. So for me he did intend to take the man and clean him out, but I'm pretty sure there was no intent to break his jaw.

Like I say I'm not moaning or playing the victim, I'd be in the camp of you need to win the physical battle before you deserve the right to play and impose your game, Tyrone did that and imposed their game and with their skill rightly won, but Tyrone came for lumps as well and some players were targeted three Dublin players went of injured, that's just the fact of it in my opinion.

Again I'm not moaning, I enjoy a good physical contest, but as a Dub we need to save that experience and context of that game and learn from it the next time we meet them, they will be high up on our hit list now, just as we were for them before Saturday, we will be looking forward to playing them.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 19/03/2019 19:36:53    2173787

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "You make some great points there Llaw like you say teams are usually beat before they hit the pitch to play the dubs and when you look at the way Tyrone and Donegal and Roscommon approached the super 8 games against them last year the plan was to keep the score down and shoot out between eachother for the second spot, and that was understandable for last year but this year maybe team will take a bit of belief from Tyrone Kerry and Monaghan's victories over them and attack them.

Mikey Sheehy said when we were going for the 5 that they had done all the same preparation but that they all just felt flat ? Maybe just a lack of hunger or whatever.

Can you imagine the team that could stop the 5 would probably end up more famous than the team that did the 4"
I think it was Seamus Darby rather than Offaly, KingdomBoy, who became famous for stopping the Kerry five in a row. It wasn't the defeat really but the manner of it. Had Kerry been beaten by six or seven points the game would just be a statistic at this stage. The fact that it was a last minute goal by the underdogs against the best team of all time made it the stuff of fairy tales. Mind you it didn't take away from the legacy of that team as eight titles between seventy five and eighty six was some achievement. The five in a row would have been the icing on the cake. Similarly if Dublin were to lose this year they would still be remembered in forty years time as one of the all time greats and it wouldn't take away from what they have achieved. I still think the Kerry team of the seventies and eighties was the best I have seen. Maybe it's because I was more impressionable at that time but if the Dubs were to win the five in a row I might have to revise my thinking. I think the Dubs are still that bit ahead at the moment but the chasing pack are closing ever so slightly. Might be wishful thinking to believe the Dubs are slipping but it's no harm to dream!

Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 1113 - 19/03/2019 20:04:27    2173796

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Replying To TheUsername:  "I would be firmly in the camp of take your licking and move on.

But I was at the game and Tyrone were intent on revenge or putting down a marker or whatever, certain players were targeted for a licking and softening up, in my opinion. I don't have a problem with that it's up to the referee deal with it.

Fenton, Costello and Small were targeted. Two of whom went of injured and Fenton was lucky not to, but I dare say he was feeling like a second row the next day.

In Andrews case, Dublin got in behind the blanket and Paddy was in the corner and going to bear down on Morgan. Morgan came out to the corner, which was ridiculous as the last man! When he came he had to clean Paddy out, he had to take the man and concede the free. So for me he did intend to take the man and clean him out, but I'm pretty sure there was no intent to break his jaw.

Like I say I'm not moaning or playing the victim, I'd be in the camp of you need to win the physical battle before you deserve the right to play and impose your game, Tyrone did that and imposed their game and with their skill rightly won, but Tyrone came for lumps as well and some players were targeted three Dublin players went of injured, that's just the fact of it in my opinion.

Again I'm not moaning, I enjoy a good physical contest, but as a Dub we need to save that experience and context of that game and learn from it the next time we meet them, they will be high up on our hit list now, just as we were for them before Saturday, we will be looking forward to playing them."
but you are moaning poor Dublin a team stood up to them and now yous cant take it
its not like Peter Harte or Mattie have not get special treatment from the Dublin back 6 over the past few years no one better than Pilly and Cooper to dish out cynical tackles in the name of victory.
Yes it is a bad injury and no one likes to see that but I am very interested what stand you where in on Saturday night as from where I was I didn't see Paddy Andrews anywhere near the goal never mind bearing down on goal and you also seem to be able to read Morgan's mind.

redbomb (Tyrone) - Posts: 167 - 19/03/2019 20:24:17    2173801

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What a performance by Tyrone on Saturday night! I have never seen this current Dublin team beaten in the manner they were on Saturday night. Up to now I thought these Dublin guys were invincible but Tyrone certainly showed up a few chunks in their armour. At the start of the season I would have said 5 in a row was a dead cert. I am not so sure now.

downtothecore (Down) - Posts: 349 - 19/03/2019 20:46:38    2173804

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Replying To redbomb:  "but you are moaning poor Dublin a team stood up to them and now yous cant take it
its not like Peter Harte or Mattie have not get special treatment from the Dublin back 6 over the past few years no one better than Pilly and Cooper to dish out cynical tackles in the name of victory.
Yes it is a bad injury and no one likes to see that but I am very interested what stand you where in on Saturday night as from where I was I didn't see Paddy Andrews anywhere near the goal never mind bearing down on goal and you also seem to be able to read Morgan's mind."
You really need to learn how to punctuate. Your posts are extremely hard to read.

Maybe just think about adding a full stop at the end of each sentence. It will make all the difference.

Wally (Tyrone) - Posts: 912 - 19/03/2019 20:48:15    2173805

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Replying To TheUsername:  "I would be firmly in the camp of take your licking and move on.

But I was at the game and Tyrone were intent on revenge or putting down a marker or whatever, certain players were targeted for a licking and softening up, in my opinion. I don't have a problem with that it's up to the referee deal with it.

Fenton, Costello and Small were targeted. Two of whom went of injured and Fenton was lucky not to, but I dare say he was feeling like a second row the next day.

In Andrews case, Dublin got in behind the blanket and Paddy was in the corner and going to bear down on Morgan. Morgan came out to the corner, which was ridiculous as the last man! When he came he had to clean Paddy out, he had to take the man and concede the free. So for me he did intend to take the man and clean him out, but I'm pretty sure there was no intent to break his jaw.

Like I say I'm not moaning or playing the victim, I'd be in the camp of you need to win the physical battle before you deserve the right to play and impose your game, Tyrone did that and imposed their game and with their skill rightly won, but Tyrone came for lumps as well and some players were targeted three Dublin players went of injured, that's just the fact of it in my opinion.

Again I'm not moaning, I enjoy a good physical contest, but as a Dub we need to save that experience and context of that game and learn from it the next time we meet them, they will be high up on our hit list now, just as we were for them before Saturday, we will be looking forward to playing them."
You keep saying you're not moaning but it does sound like moaning.

You're boys are well able to dish it out and get away with murder from refs, 19 year old seanie Shea hospitalized by a couple of yer lot in last years league game in crokepark, 2 years previous also in crokepark Costello chokes out 20 year old brian o'beaglaoich not to mention what Philly did to donaghys eyes.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 19/03/2019 20:52:12    2173808

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What a load of auld snowflake talk, all the top teams over the years were well able to 'give it'. You can hardly touch a player these days without all hell breaking loose on social media. If the incident is nasty enough, let the cops deal with it, otherwise between the whining and the 'mark' the game is getting harder to watch all the time.
Everyone has an opinion and that's mine.
Kerry will always refer to us as the 'dirty dubs' because in fairness to them, they never housed a dirty player in their saintly history.

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8585 - 19/03/2019 21:04:09    2173809

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Ha ha, nope we take our lumps and move on, but more importantly remember.

Overall we're in the wrong place at the right time of the year, that's a fluid situation.

I can't stop the fact that three Dublin players went off injured, call it an amazing coincidence if you like, the game was it was, we move on, no interest in whataboutry, we have lads who have and will put it about admittedly. iIt was a useful exercise for us all in all, as the whole league has been really.

Tyrone were full value for their win, really well deserved as I've said quite a lot. I think they are our closest rivals in all honesty.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 19/03/2019 21:13:29    2173812

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