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Replying To jonjon: "Rare to get a Dub who admits that. Time we built a truly neutral venue to host All-Irelands, or time for Dublin to get a different home ground that can host them and leave Croke Park for All-Ireland semis and finals." Yeah. Sure now that the boom is back we'll build another rarely used white elephant in the middle if nowhere and ignore the best stadium in the country with great access by road and public transport. The next stadium to be built in Ireland with the help of taxpayers money needs to groundshare with other sports and use facilities for corporate/concerts etc to get a return on the investment. We spent long enough suffering to get out of a recession, makes no sense throwing money away to drop us onto another one.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7344 - 17/09/2019 18:51:44
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Replying To MesAmis: "Also Jonjon, I have not attacked you as a person.
I've attacked the fact that you've told a lie.
Don't compound your original lie with yet more lies.
An attack on your posts is not an attack on you personally.
Just so we're clear, your post was a lie and I don't know if your a habitual liar or not but find it strange that you double down on your lie when it's clear that you're telling a lie.
I don't think anything above is an unreasonable thing to think." Also important to note the timing of his posts and post count and that all of his posts are about Dublin. WUM.
Jackeen (Dublin) - Posts: 4097 - 17/09/2019 19:21:03
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Replying To GreenandRed: "Yeah. Sure now that the boom is back we'll build another rarely used white elephant in the middle if nowhere and ignore the best stadium in the country with great access by road and public transport. The next stadium to be built in Ireland with the help of taxpayers money needs to groundshare with other sports and use facilities for corporate/concerts etc to get a return on the investment. We spent long enough suffering to get out of a recession, makes no sense throwing money away to drop us onto another one." Sure go ahead and just ignore the last sentence of the post. Honestly why bother reply to a post when you're just going to ignore half of it?
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 17/09/2019 19:43:32
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Dublin posters you can gang up and use the same terminology (lies, liar, etc), but until one of you offers an explanation to the pattern of the crowds in those videos you're not refuting anything.
Why would I make up that stewards were directing Mayo supporters into a certain section of the hill?
Can of you actually explain the drastically different congregation of Mayo supporters in the 13 final vs the 17 final?
Can any of you explain why my experience matches up with another poster who said the same thing?
All you do is continue to type lies and liar.
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 17/09/2019 19:50:57
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Replying To Jackeen: "Also important to note the timing of his posts and post count and that all of his posts are about Dublin. WUM." I'm hardly going to wait half a year to write posts on a topic that's currently in discussion.
And by your logic any poster with a low post count is a WUM.
Did every new poster start off as a WUM so?
After how many posts does a new poster graduate from being a WUM to a regular poster?
Terrible logic.
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 17/09/2019 19:53:47
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Replying To jonjon: " Replying To MesAmis: "[quote=jonjon: "[quote=MesAmis: "It is not a lie.
Obviously it is much harder to separate fans on the Hill than it is in say a premier league game, as tickets to the hill are just general admission and you can stand whereever, so it is not a 100% separation of fans.
However, stewards have clearly been directed to separate opposition fans from Dublin fans.
Take a look at the highlights from from 2019 All Ireland final, or the 2017 All Ireland final or the 2016 replay.
Notice how the majority of the Mayo and Kerry fans have been directed up to the side of the hill near the cusack stand.
I didn't stand on the hill on those days but I heard from my friends straight after the match how stewards were separating Mayo fans from Dubs and directing them up to that section of the hill.
It was also clear as day when looking at the hill from the cusack stand where I was sitting, and it's still clear as day today when you look at the highlights on YouTube, it's especially obvious in the 2017 final due to the numbers of Mayo fans who had tickets for the hill.
Someone in this thread posted a similar story. I'll quote it for you:
"2 weeks ago a couple of Kerry young lads were in the hill for the minor game (cork and Galway) and they situated themselves behind the goals when the stewards came down and told them move up to the back corner, when the 2 lads asked why they had to move they were told it was for their own safety"
I hope you'll take this on board, and apologise for calling me a liar.
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 17 - 17/09/2019 12:31:53
You have lied though, I don't know if you are a habitual liar or not but you've certainly lied here.
I've been on the hill for all those games and there was no attempt to stop people from standing in any particular section according to what county they were from.
There were Kerry people in all different sections of the Hill on Saturday, as there had been for the drawn game. They were there beside me, directly behind the goals.
Stewards ask people to move if they are in a section that is over full or if they are blocking the steps. And that is of course for their own safety and the safety of all others on the terrace, and quite right too.
I can't apologise for calling you a liar because you are clearly telling lies.
There is no attempt to separate fans on Hill 16. Otherwise how do you explain the fact that there were Kerry and Dublin fans in all corners of the hill last Saturday as well as at the drawn match. The same in the recent finals against Mayo, there were Dublin and Mayo fans in all sections of the hill, there were Tyrone and Dublin fans in all sections of the hill last year.
Your lie is quite so obviously a lie that it is staggering that you are so committed to your lie." As I have already said, separating fans in the hill is not an exact science as there are not separate tickets for separate sections. Obviously you end up with a mix of supporters, the stewards cannot do a perfect job. you have just latched onto this and wrote a whole post about it, even though I've already addressed it. Why haven't you addressed any of the actual points I wrote? Did you actually look at the YouTube video of the 2017 All Ireland final? Are you calling the other poster who spoke about the exact same thing a liar as well? You can personally insult me and question whether I am a habitual liar and if I like to lie, but you are not attacking my points, you are attacking me as a person. Considering that you clearly didn't bother watch any videos on YouTube I am going to make that job a little bit easier for you. I am going to provide you now with a link to fan footage of the parade before the 2017 final. Tell me why do you think that the section of the hill beside the cusack stand is made up of almost entirely Mayo supporters? Whilst the seciton behind the goal is almost entirely made up of Dublin supporters? That is so so weird. You'd almost swear they were all directed there by stewards. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TF0eKIMk-kk Now I'll direct you to the 2013 final, where you can see what a natural mix of supporters in the Hill looks like. Skip to 7:37 in the video when Stephen Cluxton is taking a free kick. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozlTHAYAvJc&t=459s Now that you've watched those videos, coupled with the anecdotal evidence myself and another poster have provided, can I finally have that apology?"
There is no seperation of supporters on the Hill. You can anywhere you like, I've stood beside big groups of Mayo /Kerry/Tyrone fans at all the finals of late.
I've looked at your videos and you can see that supporters congregate with their own but there is still clearly blue mixed with red and green and vice versa. There is no clear dividing line, just areas with less Dubs and areas with less Mayo. Not seperation between them all and yet you think it proves your point! Very strange, that you just keep doubling down with your lies when it's clear as day that you're telling a lie."]So how woud you explain the difference between the random, natural, congregation of supporters in the 2013 final, and the fact that the majority of Mayo supporters are at the sides of the Hill in the 2017 final?"]1st of all, one side of the hill that is 'all Mayo' is acctually the Nally terrace. Mayo might have gotten more Nally tickets, still a mix in there to be fair though you might not acknowledge that.
Dubs fans all have their spots on the Hill, the section directly behind the goal is often the only one open (league and early championship etc) so Dubs went to their usual spots still with a few Mayo groups in there and Mayo fans congregated naturally on the curve again with some Dubs groups mixed in. No one told anyone where they could or could not stand based on the county affiliation.
In 2013 Mayo were in the minor so were in earlier and so the natural congregations weren't as big and again there was a nice mix between the fans.
There were no stewards shepparding Dubs one way and Mayo the other way.
Just think of it logistically, it'd be impossible without printing different tickets with sections on them and having different entrances which don't exist going into the Hill as everyone goes in together down the same street. Not to mention that the GAA would have to ensure that only Mayo fans got Mayo section tickets and only Dubs got Dub section tickets and we all know that the way All-Ireland tickets are distributed makes your theory stupid and silly looking.
Your lie is ridiculous to be fair. Organised seperation of fans has never happened.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13707 - 17/09/2019 20:05:34
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Replying To jonjon: "Dublin posters you can gang up and use the same terminology (lies, liar, etc), but until one of you offers an explanation to the pattern of the crowds in those videos you're not refuting anything.
Why would I make up that stewards were directing Mayo supporters into a certain section of the hill?
Can of you actually explain the drastically different congregation of Mayo supporters in the 13 final vs the 17 final?
Can any of you explain why my experience matches up with another poster who said the same thing?
All you do is continue to type lies and liar." Posters are saying your telling lies because you are telling lies.
If you don't want people accusing you of telling lies then don't tell lies.
There has never been organised seperation of fans on the Hill. It can be clearly seen in all the recent All-Ireland finals involving Dublin that Dublin and opposition fans are standing side by side enjoying the match.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13707 - 17/09/2019 20:08:35
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Replying To jonjon: "I'm hardly going to wait half a year to write posts on a topic that's currently in discussion.
And by your logic any poster with a low post count is a WUM.
Did every new poster start off as a WUM so?
After how many posts does a new poster graduate from being a WUM to a regular poster?
Terrible logic." Its pretty obvious who the wums are around here. And you are one of a handful that has cropped up in the past few weeks.
Jackeen (Dublin) - Posts: 4097 - 17/09/2019 20:17:32
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Replying To MesAmis: "Posters are saying your telling lies because you are telling lies.
If you don't want people accusing you of telling lies then don't tell lies.
There has never been organised seperation of fans on the Hill. It can be clearly seen in all the recent All-Ireland finals involving Dublin that Dublin and opposition fans are standing side by side enjoying the match." Answer my question. Why is there such a different pattern in the congregation in the 17 final vs the 13 final?
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 17/09/2019 20:22:46
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Replying To jonjon: "Answer my question. Why is there such a different pattern in the congregation in the 17 final vs the 13 final?" Explained above.
Would you explain the logistics and procedures the GAA put in place to ensure this phantom segregation?
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13707 - 17/09/2019 20:26:19
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Replying To jonjon: "Sure go ahead and just ignore the last sentence of the post. Honestly why bother reply to a post when you're just going to ignore half of it?" That's it. Sure but a Fisher Price calculator and see if you can work it.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7344 - 17/09/2019 20:27:30
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Replying To jonjon: "Sure go ahead and just ignore the last sentence of the post. Honestly why bother reply to a post when you're just going to ignore half of it?" That's it. Sure but a Fisher Price calculator and see if you can work it.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7344 - 17/09/2019 20:27:44
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Replying To MesAmis: " Replying To jonjon: "[quote=MesAmis: "[quote=jonjon: "[quote=MesAmis: "It is not a lie.
Obviously it is much harder to separate fans on the Hill than it is in say a premier league game, as tickets to the hill are just general admission and you can stand whereever, so it is not a 100% separation of fans.
However, stewards have clearly been directed to separate opposition fans from Dublin fans.
Take a look at the highlights from from 2019 All Ireland final, or the 2017 All Ireland final or the 2016 replay.
Notice how the majority of the Mayo and Kerry fans have been directed up to the side of the hill near the cusack stand.
I didn't stand on the hill on those days but I heard from my friends straight after the match how stewards were separating Mayo fans from Dubs and directing them up to that section of the hill.
It was also clear as day when looking at the hill from the cusack stand where I was sitting, and it's still clear as day today when you look at the highlights on YouTube, it's especially obvious in the 2017 final due to the numbers of Mayo fans who had tickets for the hill.
Someone in this thread posted a similar story. I'll quote it for you:
"2 weeks ago a couple of Kerry young lads were in the hill for the minor game (cork and Galway) and they situated themselves behind the goals when the stewards came down and told them move up to the back corner, when the 2 lads asked why they had to move they were told it was for their own safety"
I hope you'll take this on board, and apologise for calling me a liar.
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 17 - 17/09/2019 12:31:53
You have lied though, I don't know if you are a habitual liar or not but you've certainly lied here.
I've been on the hill for all those games and there was no attempt to stop people from standing in any particular section according to what county they were from.
There were Kerry people in all different sections of the Hill on Saturday, as there had been for the drawn game. They were there beside me, directly behind the goals.
Stewards ask people to move if they are in a section that is over full or if they are blocking the steps. And that is of course for their own safety and the safety of all others on the terrace, and quite right too.
I can't apologise for calling you a liar because you are clearly telling lies.
There is no attempt to separate fans on Hill 16. Otherwise how do you explain the fact that there were Kerry and Dublin fans in all corners of the hill last Saturday as well as at the drawn match. The same in the recent finals against Mayo, there were Dublin and Mayo fans in all sections of the hill, there were Tyrone and Dublin fans in all sections of the hill last year.
Your lie is quite so obviously a lie that it is staggering that you are so committed to your lie." As I have already said, separating fans in the hill is not an exact science as there are not separate tickets for separate sections. Obviously you end up with a mix of supporters, the stewards cannot do a perfect job. you have just latched onto this and wrote a whole post about it, even though I've already addressed it. Why haven't you addressed any of the actual points I wrote? Did you actually look at the YouTube video of the 2017 All Ireland final? Are you calling the other poster who spoke about the exact same thing a liar as well? You can personally insult me and question whether I am a habitual liar and if I like to lie, but you are not attacking my points, you are attacking me as a person. Considering that you clearly didn't bother watch any videos on YouTube I am going to make that job a little bit easier for you. I am going to provide you now with a link to fan footage of the parade before the 2017 final. Tell me why do you think that the section of the hill beside the cusack stand is made up of almost entirely Mayo supporters? Whilst the seciton behind the goal is almost entirely made up of Dublin supporters? That is so so weird. You'd almost swear they were all directed there by stewards. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TF0eKIMk-kk Now I'll direct you to the 2013 final, where you can see what a natural mix of supporters in the Hill looks like. Skip to 7:37 in the video when Stephen Cluxton is taking a free kick. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozlTHAYAvJc&t=459s Now that you've watched those videos, coupled with the anecdotal evidence myself and another poster have provided, can I finally have that apology?"
There is no seperation of supporters on the Hill. You can anywhere you like, I've stood beside big groups of Mayo /Kerry/Tyrone fans at all the finals of late.
I've looked at your videos and you can see that supporters congregate with their own but there is still clearly blue mixed with red and green and vice versa. There is no clear dividing line, just areas with less Dubs and areas with less Mayo. Not seperation between them all and yet you think it proves your point! Very strange, that you just keep doubling down with your lies when it's clear as day that you're telling a lie."]So how woud you explain the difference between the random, natural, congregation of supporters in the 2013 final, and the fact that the majority of Mayo supporters are at the sides of the Hill in the 2017 final?"]1st of all, one side of the hill that is 'all Mayo' is acctually the Nally terrace. Mayo might have gotten more Nally tickets, still a mix in there to be fair though you might not acknowledge that.
Dubs fans all have their spots on the Hill, the section directly behind the goal is often the only one open (league and early championship etc) so Dubs went to their usual spots still with a few Mayo groups in there and Mayo fans congregated naturally on the curve again with some Dubs groups mixed in. No one told anyone where they could or could not stand based on the county affiliation.
In 2013 Mayo were in the minor so were in earlier and so the natural congregations weren't as big and again there was a nice mix between the fans.
There were no stewards shepparding Dubs one way and Mayo the other way.
Just think of it logistically, it'd be impossible without printing different tickets with sections on them and having different entrances which don't exist going into the Hill as everyone goes in together down the same street. Not to mention that the GAA would have to ensure that only Mayo fans got Mayo section tickets and only Dubs got Dub section tickets and we all know that the way All-Ireland tickets are distributed makes your theory stupid and silly looking.
Your lie is ridiculous to be fair. Organised seperation of fans has never happened."]You've literally answered one of your questions here, the logistics of separating fans is impossible to do via ticketing, so the stewards did it which is why it there ends up being a small mix of fans in certain areas.
Also, you mention the nally. That's the section beside the Hogan stand. I explicitly referred to the other side, the side by the cusack stand. In the video it is clearly about 90 percent mayo fans.
Your point on the minor being on first in 2013 makes exactly zero sense. You claim that because Mayo fans were in earlier they ended up congregating together less. How does that make sense? If all the Mayo fans were in early they would congregate together MORE. You literally just handed me that one, clearly weren't thinking before typing that.
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 17/09/2019 20:29:55
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jonjon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxVkVzXci6M
Go to 1:26:37
A fine view of the hill. Yes there are more Dubs behind the goal and more Mayo on the curve. However there are clearly groups of Red/Green in the more Blue section and clearly groups of Blue in the Red/Green section on the curve.
There is no seperation.
Stop your lies.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13707 - 17/09/2019 20:31:54
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Replying To GreenandRed: "That's it. Sure but a Fisher Price calculator and see if you can work it." Oh yeah completely forgot it was the GAA building stadiums that caused the recession as well. Honestly, linking the GAA building a stadium with the recession was a ridiculous point to make as a reason Dublin should continue to enjoy home advantage in the deciding match of the championship.
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 17/09/2019 20:32:13
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Replying To MesAmis: "Explained above.
Would you explain the logistics and procedures the GAA put in place to ensure this phantom segregation?" As you've seen I've already explained the logistics. I actually explained that on page 5 or 6 when I was replying to you, you don't seem to have taken it on board.
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 17/09/2019 20:33:28
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Replying To jonjon: "Oh yeah completely forgot it was the GAA building stadiums that caused the recession as well. Honestly, linking the GAA building a stadium with the recession was a ridiculous point to make as a reason Dublin should continue to enjoy home advantage in the deciding match of the championship." Yeah. Fisher Price Junior C trolling. Money grows on trees where you're from.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7344 - 17/09/2019 20:45:34
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Replying To MesAmis: "jonjon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxVkVzXci6M
Go to 1:26:37
A fine view of the hill. Yes there are more Dubs behind the goal and more Mayo on the curve. However there are clearly groups of Red/Green in the more Blue section and clearly groups of Blue in the Red/Green section on the curve.
There is no seperation.
Stop your lies." I've already explained why there's a small mix in those areas. Also to add to the points I've already made on that; the minor match involved Derry that day, so you can see plenty of Red and white in the mainly Dubs area behind the goal.
Glad to see you've finally admitted that there are more Mayo supporters on the curve though. Now tell me why it looks so structured in the 17 final and so unstructured in the 13 final.
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 17/09/2019 20:48:56
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Replying To jonjon: "I've already explained why there's a small mix in those areas. Also to add to the points I've already made on that; the minor match involved Derry that day, so you can see plenty of Red and white in the mainly Dubs area behind the goal.
Glad to see you've finally admitted that there are more Mayo supporters on the curve though. Now tell me why it looks so structured in the 17 final and so unstructured in the 13 final." So now you're saying that there was a mix........
C'mon man it is as clear as day that there are Mayo fans mixed with Dubs and Dubs fans mixed with Mayo.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13707 - 17/09/2019 20:53:06
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Replying To MesAmis: "So now you're saying that there was a mix........
C'mon man it is as clear as day that there are Mayo fans mixed with Dubs and Dubs fans mixed with Mayo." I've never said there wasn't a mix? In fact I clearly stated pages back that it isn't an exact science.
If there is such free mixing of fans then why on earth are all the Mayo fans up in the corner on the curve?
It didn't look anything like that for the 2013 match, and doesn't look anything like that for any of the hurling finals.
jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 17/09/2019 21:04:39
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