National Forum

Hand Pass Rule Common Sense Prevails

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post


Replying To Kingofthehill100:  "The team with the ball isn't the problem. So limiting them going back isn't really addressing the correct team. The team who are defending with 15 men in their own 45 are the issue. Either way we have new rules to taste and we should discuss these rather than proposed rules. The attacking mark will hopefully be a turning point for attractive football"
Agree with this. As much as I love going to Dublin games, as a spectacle there's no doubt that this lark of packing 15 inside the 45 is tarnishing the entertainment levels. Both Dublin and Galway were at it on Saturday and there were many lulls in tempo as both sides probed around the opposition 45 with handpasses. It's almost inevitable that a keep x men forward rule is introduced. Basketball have succesdfully introduced many "second" violation rules over the years to force attacking play and open the game up; shot clock, 3, 6 and 8 second rules. I feel that football needs that kind of out of the box thinking to combat this massed zonal defence blight.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 05/02/2019 19:50:30    2162835

Link

I agree with Joxer on this, some means of forcing a team out to contest has to be found. I'm in favour of limiting how far you can bring the ball back because it might encourage teams to engage as there would be less ground to cover. Also agree that teams defending a 3 point deficit need to have a good chat with themselves

lillyboy (Kildare) - Posts: 429 - 05/02/2019 20:30:33    2162846

Link

Replying To Joxer:  "Agree with this. As much as I love going to Dublin games, as a spectacle there's no doubt that this lark of packing 15 inside the 45 is tarnishing the entertainment levels. Both Dublin and Galway were at it on Saturday and there were many lulls in tempo as both sides probed around the opposition 45 with handpasses. It's almost inevitable that a keep x men forward rule is introduced. Basketball have succesdfully introduced many "second" violation rules over the years to force attacking play and open the game up; shot clock, 3, 6 and 8 second rules. I feel that football needs that kind of out of the box thinking to combat this massed zonal defence blight."
A shot clock with the current rules would only encourage defensive play even more. Get all your 15 players into your own 45 and then the attacking team has to shoot from distance before the timer.

Kingofthehill100 (Mayo) - Posts: 68 - 06/02/2019 11:30:19    2162939

Link

Replying To hurlorhurley:  "Managers are ruining the game most of them afraid to lose rather than trying to win"
That is the stupidest comment I've ever seen. I've seen a few people say it. It doesn't even make sense.

gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 06/02/2019 12:11:59    2162949

Link

Replying To lillyboy:  "A way has to be found to force teams to push out and contest the ball outside their own 45. Should we limit how far you can work the ball back to encourage this? Solutions have to be practical and workable at club level"
Shots outside the 45 are worth 2 points...simple.

gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 06/02/2019 12:12:35    2162950

Link

Replying To GeniusGerry:  "I don't think the handpass rule was in force for that game?"
That's the point.. Without the handpass they were struggling to kick the ball.

ExiledForSins (Mayo) - Posts: 15 - 06/02/2019 13:34:37    2162974

Link

Replying To hurlorhurley:  "Wexford made a total of 35 handpasses in succession in a 3 minute period of holding possession against Antrim last Sunday in Wexford Park. If the handpass rule had stood they would have had to kick the ball 11 times in that period.

Wexford were three points in front Antrim were defending deep Wexford went from the Antrim 21 the whole way back to their goalkeeper twice during the passage of play.

Absolute puke football to watch."
Good post.. Totally illustrates the need for change.

ExiledForSins (Mayo) - Posts: 15 - 06/02/2019 13:37:59    2162977

Link

Replying To bloodyban:  "Limiting substitutions to 3 is a total non runner. It doesnt allow tactical personel changes and stifles managers. It just suits teams with poor squads. Why reward mediocre squads."
I disagree.. It would open up the game for weaker counties that don't have the population. Plus teams have to field their strongest teams.

ExiledForSins (Mayo) - Posts: 15 - 06/02/2019 13:40:56    2162979

Link

Replying To Kingofthehill100:  "A shot clock with the current rules would only encourage defensive play even more. Get all your 15 players into your own 45 and then the attacking team has to shoot from distance before the timer."
No not suggestng a shot clock just illustrating how basketball have introduced innovative rules over the years to encourage attacking play. I think we may see x players from each team have to be present in the attacking teams own half once the ball crosses halfway line. Something like that to generate space yet still keep the man to man numbers.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 06/02/2019 14:25:26    2162988

Link

Replying To Joxer:  "No not suggestng a shot clock just illustrating how basketball have introduced innovative rules over the years to encourage attacking play. I think we may see x players from each team have to be present in the attacking teams own half once the ball crosses halfway line. Something like that to generate space yet still keep the man to man numbers."
That rule wouldn't work either. Would also kill attacking play as it would kill players running from deep. If you were still to allow attacking players to come from deep you would also need to allow a player to follow them defensively.

Would also reward lightening quick players who may not have much skill but are like olympic sprinters.

gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 06/02/2019 15:00:17    2162996

Link

Replying To ExiledForSins:  "Good post.. Totally illustrates the need for change."
Ah not really.

I mean Antrim are just not good right now even by our own admittedly low standards. FIFA don't change the rules of football based on the entertainment value generated by the Irish national team.

There are a lot of bad negative teams. For a while there was some success coming for counterattacking teams. I think that's lessening.

You see some previously very tactical sides are now having to find new attacking solutions to compete.

At the top level I think the game will improve.

I think there's not much to be done about bad teams trying to play negatively and creating a terrible spectacle. That could happen regardless of the rules.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4208 - 06/02/2019 15:40:32    2163006

Link

Replying To gotmilk:  "That rule wouldn't work either. Would also kill attacking play as it would kill players running from deep. If you were still to allow attacking players to come from deep you would also need to allow a player to follow them defensively.

Would also reward lightening quick players who may not have much skill but are like olympic sprinters."
Not a perfect solution at all but I can see something like this coming in. No harm in such a rule favouring fast players, you could make the same case for the offside rule in soccer, anything that promotes fast attacking play and opens up the defending teams half is to be welcomed. Could be enforced with a ref in each half.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 06/02/2019 18:02:46    2163048

Link

Replying To Joxer:  "Not a perfect solution at all but I can see something like this coming in. No harm in such a rule favouring fast players, you could make the same case for the offside rule in soccer, anything that promotes fast attacking play and opens up the defending teams half is to be welcomed. Could be enforced with a ref in each half."
Why should fast players be favoured over strong players?

I'm only playing devils advocate here btw.

gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 07/02/2019 14:18:09    2163214

Link

Replying To gotmilk:  "Why should fast players be favoured over strong players?

I'm only playing devils advocate here btw."
Only speculating but I suppose fast players make football exciting. Do strong players?

Kingofthehill100 (Mayo) - Posts: 68 - 07/02/2019 14:28:49    2163217

Link