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Rochford Resigns

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Very good manager it's a pity to see him walk away. I don't know what is going on behind the scenes but it seems his departure is not on the best of terms which is an even greater pity. He will be coveted by other teams I have no doubt. Good luck to him whatever his next move is.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 28/08/2018 14:36:04    2137131

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Replying To Liamwalkinstown:  "Wayne, do me a favour, just ignore me ok bud.
Thanks

Re Jim, I see what you're saying Mes and I just don't agree.
Jim and his protege Rory, and its only an opinion, have left a mark on football and its more of a scar.
Their brand of football, for me, is horrible and yep, is what I would call anti-football.

I am very annoyed at what the game has become, its been destroyed. 90% of counties play horrible football now.
The game is ruined, and for me, a lot of that goes back to the Jim McG handbook on how to beat teams who play football. Limited panels see their only way of playing at the top level as this awful shite, and it has seeped into underage club football now. Dublin are guilty of a bit of it this year also, I am not blind to that atall. It got Fermanagh to an Ulster final this year.

Look, I know this pov annoys a lot of ye, and Lockjaw i am sorry lad but i Honestly believe this.

Peace :)"
Are managers across the country unable to think for themselves? Is this Pjongyang?

Jim invented this system yes, because it suited Donegal and the players we had. No-one held a gun to anyone's head to say that this was THE only way to beat better teams. I enjoy all these purists out there harping on about some halcyon times that in truth never really existed. Watch a game on TG4 Gold. A lot of the time the quality is actually shite.

Or would it be better if we just had a Kerry Dublin final every year? Jim's system disrupted the status quo and that's the real agenda I think.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9115 - 28/08/2018 14:49:20    2137136

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Replying To Lockjaw:  "Are managers across the country unable to think for themselves? Is this Pjongyang?

Jim invented this system yes, because it suited Donegal and the players we had. No-one held a gun to anyone's head to say that this was THE only way to beat better teams. I enjoy all these purists out there harping on about some halcyon times that in truth never really existed. Watch a game on TG4 Gold. A lot of the time the quality is actually shite.

Or would it be better if we just had a Kerry Dublin final every year? Jim's system disrupted the status quo and that's the real agenda I think."
its not atall LJ
The mad thing is, Donegal were'nt even the worst at this type of "football" not even close!
Donegal had some top class players like Lacey, McFadden, Murphy, McHugh x 2, McGee's x 2, Frank etc but he brought a style of play that took the worst years of Mickey Harte and multiplied it 5 fold

Look, I get that it won Donegal an AI and it will be impossible for you to say anything negative about it, but for me and trust me, its nothing to do with Dublin, I am talking about the game itself, the very sport of Gaelic Football, I think anyone who looks at football now and fails to see the negative knock on of those tactics on the current game all the way down to schools level, and the utter STATE of football now, is kidding themselves

And to repeat and to clarify, I see my own Dubs employ a bit of it at times out of sheer necessity and I despise it.

I hate what football has become.

Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts: 8166 - 28/08/2018 14:56:54    2137139

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Replying To Liamwalkinstown:  "its not atall LJ
The mad thing is, Donegal were'nt even the worst at this type of "football" not even close!
Donegal had some top class players like Lacey, McFadden, Murphy, McHugh x 2, McGee's x 2, Frank etc but he brought a style of play that took the worst years of Mickey Harte and multiplied it 5 fold

Look, I get that it won Donegal an AI and it will be impossible for you to say anything negative about it, but for me and trust me, its nothing to do with Dublin, I am talking about the game itself, the very sport of Gaelic Football, I think anyone who looks at football now and fails to see the negative knock on of those tactics on the current game all the way down to schools level, and the utter STATE of football now, is kidding themselves

And to repeat and to clarify, I see my own Dubs employ a bit of it at times out of sheer necessity and I despise it.

I hate what football has become."
You are sounding a bit like Victor Meldrew Liam.

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 2739 - 28/08/2018 15:38:51    2137164

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "You are sounding a bit like Victor Meldrew Liam."
I don't belieevvee it!!

Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts: 8166 - 28/08/2018 16:04:33    2137179

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Replying To Liamwalkinstown:  "its not atall LJ
The mad thing is, Donegal were'nt even the worst at this type of "football" not even close!
Donegal had some top class players like Lacey, McFadden, Murphy, McHugh x 2, McGee's x 2, Frank etc but he brought a style of play that took the worst years of Mickey Harte and multiplied it 5 fold

Look, I get that it won Donegal an AI and it will be impossible for you to say anything negative about it, but for me and trust me, its nothing to do with Dublin, I am talking about the game itself, the very sport of Gaelic Football, I think anyone who looks at football now and fails to see the negative knock on of those tactics on the current game all the way down to schools level, and the utter STATE of football now, is kidding themselves

And to repeat and to clarify, I see my own Dubs employ a bit of it at times out of sheer necessity and I despise it.

I hate what football has become."
I know Liam and it's not a direct pop at you. You're right it has filtered down to all levels. These bastardized impersonations of Jim's template are woeful. But to hear some people lay ALL of the blame for that at Jim's door is completely unfair and not on. It's lazy in the extreme. Instead of laying the blame at Jim's door would it not be better to improvise? A bit of outside the box thinking perhaps? No - why bother take the option that requires a bit of thinking and a bit of effort. Lets cry all the live long day about it and blame one man. That's handier.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9115 - 28/08/2018 16:06:02    2137181

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Replying To Lockjaw:  "I know Liam and it's not a direct pop at you. You're right it has filtered down to all levels. These bastardized impersonations of Jim's template are woeful. But to hear some people lay ALL of the blame for that at Jim's door is completely unfair and not on. It's lazy in the extreme. Instead of laying the blame at Jim's door would it not be better to improvise? A bit of outside the box thinking perhaps? No - why bother take the option that requires a bit of thinking and a bit of effort. Lets cry all the live long day about it and blame one man. That's handier."
Jim didn't do himself any favours with that article in the times last week so LJ
More or less advocating Tyrone play THREE sweepers and leave 13 behind the ball at all times and for a 0-3 0-2 win.........

yuck

Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts: 8166 - 28/08/2018 16:20:47    2137189

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Some amount of revisionism goes on sometimes hey. Everyone said Donegal played great stuff in 2012. Fast forward a few years and it's trendy to say that Jim is the bringer of all evil, so that "horrible style of play" won us an All-Ireland. Sit down and watch us blow away everyone in Ulster and watch the 2nd half against Cork and tell me we played horrible stuff. Nonsense posts from nonsense people who can't think critically for themselves.

Anyway I doubt Jim would take the job, he has worked very hard on his coaching badges. But as has been mentioned, he has great admiration for this Mayo team so he could be tempted. To be very honest though I don't think Mayo players or fans would want him.

All the best to Rochford, seems like the county board are a real mess over there. I liked Rochford, I think he would've eventually got this squad over the line too.

JoeSoap (Donegal) - Posts: 1432 - 28/08/2018 16:43:55    2137203

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Would the McGuinness style suit Mayo? We have generally played off the cuff attacking football but the patronizing comments of "ah sure poor Mayo but sure ye play great football" are horse crap. Would I put up with defensive football or rather a change in our style if it meant witnessing us win an All Ireland? At this stage I would, yeah.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11227 - 28/08/2018 19:14:02    2137254

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Best of luck to Stephen Rochford, at least he played the game the way it should be played.

tireoghainabu (Tyrone) - Posts: 274 - 28/08/2018 19:28:27    2137256

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Replying To Lockjaw:  "I know Liam and it's not a direct pop at you. You're right it has filtered down to all levels. These bastardized impersonations of Jim's template are woeful. But to hear some people lay ALL of the blame for that at Jim's door is completely unfair and not on. It's lazy in the extreme. Instead of laying the blame at Jim's door would it not be better to improvise? A bit of outside the box thinking perhaps? No - why bother take the option that requires a bit of thinking and a bit of effort. Lets cry all the live long day about it and blame one man. That's handier."
Jim played his part in the evolution of the recent game , however that's only part of the narrative, he prepared a team of good footballers into a beast of a team both mentally and physically, he delivered an All Ireland , he took a team of perennial losers and gave them belief, he didn't reinvent the wheel he saw benefits in giving up possession becoming harder to score against and took it to a different level , was it pretty not in my eyes , did Donegal folk care not a jot , would Mayo give a hoot if he delivered the holy grail not a bit , the only issue I have with Jim is he walked away to quickly and his qualities as a coach in the fast evolving game we have today are completely unproven

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 29/08/2018 07:49:50    2137306

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Replying To Liamwalkinstown:  "Jim didn't do himself any favours with that article in the times last week so LJ
More or less advocating Tyrone play THREE sweepers and leave 13 behind the ball at all times and for a 0-3 0-2 win.........

yuck"
I read his article. All he did was highlight how Dublin played. He labelled it an extreme brand of football, which it is, it's risk free football, it's cautious and at times there is little interest in taking scores for the greater cause.

McGuinness highlighted two ways for Tyrone to approach Dublin's extreme tactics if they had any hope of beating the team going for 4 in a row. One of the two, which everyone fixated on was the extreme sweeper plan of not allowing Dublin players into the 45 to see if their own philosophy of only entering the 45 when there is an opening would be broken. Extreme vs extreme. The other plan was a lot less extreme which suits people to ignore. It had more risks but was about executing a quick transition from where Dublin start their attacks.

You can tell he put a lot of thought into these ideas and his write up should have been viewed as a fantastic insight into Sundays final. But i suppose the narrative for the avaerage pundit/journalist is to heap praise on the Dubs and how good they are and how Tyrone won't stand a chance and better not dare ruin the final with 'negative' football or tactics. Giving Dublin a free pass as well as a pat on the back even though they kill as many if not more contests than the rest with their own extreme brand.

The criticism towards Mcguinness is without merit. I think I'll take the words of the last man to create a plan that beat Dublin the championship than listen to a green eyed barrister who couldn't coach a team of under 12s. Unless we are all to accept Dublin winning all Ireland's as an annual event that is!

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2385 - 29/08/2018 10:31:22    2137330

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If Jim Mc Guinness wants the job then Mayo people should welcome him with open arms. As should the players. If the players whinge about him then they should be shown the door. Whatever about the style of football played by Donegal under him the biggest change was the fact that he took a bunch of good footballers that lacked discipline off the pitch and transformed them into a unit that did whatever was necessary to achieve the end result. They have an all ireland because of him. He was ruthless with Devenney. I feel that some of the Mayo lads need the same. Horan did it with Mortimer but I feel that Mc Guinness is a level above Horan. I think that some of the Mayo lads are just happy to be nearly men and they arent ruthless enough to achieve the end goal. They know there'll always be some eejit at hand to give them an excuse as to why they didn't win it. The funeral in Swinford or Meath were mean to us! And there's no room for prima donnas if ye want to get over the line. The team is more important than any individual and their twitter account.

ThePowerhouse (Leitrim) - Posts: 104 - 29/08/2018 11:31:03    2137351

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Replying To SaffronDon:  "I read his article. All he did was highlight how Dublin played. He labelled it an extreme brand of football, which it is, it's risk free football, it's cautious and at times there is little interest in taking scores for the greater cause.

McGuinness highlighted two ways for Tyrone to approach Dublin's extreme tactics if they had any hope of beating the team going for 4 in a row. One of the two, which everyone fixated on was the extreme sweeper plan of not allowing Dublin players into the 45 to see if their own philosophy of only entering the 45 when there is an opening would be broken. Extreme vs extreme. The other plan was a lot less extreme which suits people to ignore. It had more risks but was about executing a quick transition from where Dublin start their attacks.

You can tell he put a lot of thought into these ideas and his write up should have been viewed as a fantastic insight into Sundays final. But i suppose the narrative for the avaerage pundit/journalist is to heap praise on the Dubs and how good they are and how Tyrone won't stand a chance and better not dare ruin the final with 'negative' football or tactics. Giving Dublin a free pass as well as a pat on the back even though they kill as many if not more contests than the rest with their own extreme brand.

The criticism towards Mcguinness is without merit. I think I'll take the words of the last man to create a plan that beat Dublin the championship than listen to a green eyed barrister who couldn't coach a team of under 12s. Unless we are all to accept Dublin winning all Ireland's as an annual event that is!"
Nail on head there. We've all seen the other threads bemoaning Dublin's dominance and gripes about their financial, numerical and coaching advantages. Yet when someone has the initiative and gumption to critically analyse Dublin and propose feasible methods to beat them to he is castigated and ridiculed by hurlers on the ditch. Modern day Ireland unfortunately. We're a nation of whingers who have become soft and expect everything to be handed to us.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9115 - 29/08/2018 11:34:54    2137353

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