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Replying To realdub: "It's going to be very tough for Dublin to do it this year. If it is achieved I think it'll have to be done with some new faces. It hard to see us being able to field our 1st 15 this season.
It'll take a monumental effort and not money to make it happen!!" Its tough every year for ye and ye still keep winning. What de ye think it is for the rest of us!!. I agree with Theusername and yourself - money does not make footballers. Ye win because ye are the best. Pat is correct ye can be rattled but the big question this year like last year is; can ye be beaten (being rattled means little). Obviously the longer ye keep winning the closer ye become to be beaten. Enjoy it while it lasts.
browncows (Meath) - Posts: 2342 - 09/04/2018 01:34:19
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I read his article on Sunday about the 3 adn 4 league finals. Obviously wrote by a man who didn't watch them. Said Carlow and Fermanagh were to defensive. Carlow had 30 shots to Laois 22 and Fermanagh got 17 scores and hit a number of wides that should have been scores. It's time he stopped writing crap.
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 09/04/2018 10:01:07
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Replying To browncows: "Its tough every year for ye and ye still keep winning. What de ye think it is for the rest of us!!. I agree with Theusername and yourself - money does not make footballers. Ye win because ye are the best. Pat is correct ye can be rattled but the big question this year like last year is; can ye be beaten (being rattled means little). Obviously the longer ye keep winning the closer ye become to be beaten. Enjoy it while it lasts." Good post
It has been very tough. Hugely competitive and Dublin could have lost all 5 AI's that they've managed to dig out and win.
That's fact. Not convenient yerra.
Not only does Dublin have to take great credit for this but the teams they've managed to beat have to look at their own failings.
That's not to even mention some of the semifinals that Dublin have had to make comebacks to win.
Always the sign of a great team but also a blatant sign of how competitive this decade has truly been.
The advanced tactics and strategic planning has never been more tuned and that's has had a big impact on the game. An impact never seen on such a scale before. The game has almost been reinvented compared to the lump it forward 15 v 15 days.
Despite the utter ignorance and revisionist efforts of some it's refreshing to see a poster that's willing to look beyond their own nose and ar least recognise that Dublin have faced a series of serious challenges in order to win.
All the advantages thatc some speak of mattered very little in the 00's because Dublin were losing.
Dublin enjoyed the same natural advantages they do today (population, sponsorship, central funding, playing in Croke Park) but they didn't have the players or the belief to win.
If these factors are so important then how come Dublin couldn't beat a team outside Leinster and mirror their worst period in Dublin GAA history and fail to even reach a final across the decade.
With all the modern advantages.. Dublin had one of their worst periods in their GAA history.
The current success has not been created by pumping money into primary school coaching since 2004. That's beyond obvious.
It's based around a tactical switch in 2010 and 2 or 3 U21 sides and two men. Pat Gilroy and Jim Gavin.
The current Dublin resurrection started in 2010. Central funding and games development grants going into primary school coaching started to really take off around 04-05 and to date there's little evidence to suggest a large impact from said funding.
Kerry going for 4 in a row minor titles. The Dub U21's were far from favourites to win in 2017 and really it's a perfect example of how far the game has come tactically, Dessie and co had that team prepared superbly well and they played to their strengths and won.
Dublin are far from dominant in the age profiles that mirror up to when that funding started in 04-05
It has had zero relevance to Dublin's current success and the jury is out on its current impact down the line and had been mentioned the level of funding had been coming down over the last number of years.
Winning breeds winning and I see that as a far bigger advantage to Dublin down the line .
jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20598 - 09/04/2018 12:56:26
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Replying To browncows: "Its tough every year for ye and ye still keep winning. What de ye think it is for the rest of us!!. I agree with Theusername and yourself - money does not make footballers. Ye win because ye are the best. Pat is correct ye can be rattled but the big question this year like last year is; can ye be beaten (being rattled means little). Obviously the longer ye keep winning the closer ye become to be beaten. Enjoy it while it lasts." Absolutely
realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8584 - 09/04/2018 13:28:09
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Of course the dubs can be rattled and rattled they will be, come June the tenth at approximately 5.30 Dublin's dominence of the Leinster championship will be over and the royals will go marching on.
Royal.Legend (Meath) - Posts: 665 - 09/04/2018 14:15:59
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All that silverware in the swag bag makes an awful rattle is right Pat!
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13703 - 09/04/2018 14:26:36
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Replying To jimbodub: "Good post
It has been very tough. Hugely competitive and Dublin could have lost all 5 AI's that they've managed to dig out and win.
That's fact. Not convenient yerra.
Not only does Dublin have to take great credit for this but the teams they've managed to beat have to look at their own failings.
That's not to even mention some of the semifinals that Dublin have had to make comebacks to win.
Always the sign of a great team but also a blatant sign of how competitive this decade has truly been.
The advanced tactics and strategic planning has never been more tuned and that's has had a big impact on the game. An impact never seen on such a scale before. The game has almost been reinvented compared to the lump it forward 15 v 15 days.
Despite the utter ignorance and revisionist efforts of some it's refreshing to see a poster that's willing to look beyond their own nose and ar least recognise that Dublin have faced a series of serious challenges in order to win.
All the advantages thatc some speak of mattered very little in the 00's because Dublin were losing.
Dublin enjoyed the same natural advantages they do today (population, sponsorship, central funding, playing in Croke Park) but they didn't have the players or the belief to win.
If these factors are so important then how come Dublin couldn't beat a team outside Leinster and mirror their worst period in Dublin GAA history and fail to even reach a final across the decade.
With all the modern advantages.. Dublin had one of their worst periods in their GAA history.
The current success has not been created by pumping money into primary school coaching since 2004. That's beyond obvious.
It's based around a tactical switch in 2010 and 2 or 3 U21 sides and two men. Pat Gilroy and Jim Gavin.
The current Dublin resurrection started in 2010. Central funding and games development grants going into primary school coaching started to really take off around 04-05 and to date there's little evidence to suggest a large impact from said funding.
Kerry going for 4 in a row minor titles. The Dub U21's were far from favourites to win in 2017 and really it's a perfect example of how far the game has come tactically, Dessie and co had that team prepared superbly well and they played to their strengths and won.
Dublin are far from dominant in the age profiles that mirror up to when that funding started in 04-05
It has had zero relevance to Dublin's current success and the jury is out on its current impact down the line and had been mentioned the level of funding had been coming down over the last number of years.
Winning breeds winning and I see that as a far bigger advantage to Dublin down the line ." Yep. I take an almost perverse pride in the fact that Donegal are the only team to have beaten Dublin in Championship football in the last 5 years. We didn't finish the job against Kerry you see, so that's always thrown back at me any time I mention it. Indeed, who knows what could have happened in we'd beaten yez in the infamous 2011 semi final?
A good Dublin mate of mine even mentions 2016. If I recall rightly you had two men sent off when Ryan McHugh got a goal to bring us within a few points of yez. He said he got this horrible feeling in the pit of his stomach that Donegal were about to do another number on them. As it turned out Dublin marched on regardless while we have regressed.
My main point is though that Dublin are not invincible. You have to get up in their faces, work like bejesus and be utterly ruthless with any chances (especially goal) when they come. Time for people to stop whinging and get thinking. Mayo have been doing this without reward...yet. But others should take note.
Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9104 - 09/04/2018 14:34:46
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Replying To Lockjaw: "Yep. I take an almost perverse pride in the fact that Donegal are the only team to have beaten Dublin in Championship football in the last 5 years. We didn't finish the job against Kerry you see, so that's always thrown back at me any time I mention it. Indeed, who knows what could have happened in we'd beaten yez in the infamous 2011 semi final?
A good Dublin mate of mine even mentions 2016. If I recall rightly you had two men sent off when Ryan McHugh got a goal to bring us within a few points of yez. He said he got this horrible feeling in the pit of his stomach that Donegal were about to do another number on them. As it turned out Dublin marched on regardless while we have regressed.
My main point is though that Dublin are not invincible. You have to get up in their faces, work like bejesus and be utterly ruthless with any chances (especially goal) when they come. Time for people to stop whinging and get thinking. Mayo have been doing this without reward...yet. But others should take note." I remember McHugh's goal in 2016 exactly like that Lockjaw. We were down a man when it went in and there was definitely a sense of 'here we go again'.
I actually think that was a really underrated Dublin performance that day. Subsequently went down to 13 men too and actually finished with 12 when Fenton was black carded late on and all the subs were done.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13703 - 09/04/2018 17:30:52
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You should be proud. Donegal made a bit of show of Dublin in 2014, Dublin did well for 15-20 mins but after that tDinegal bossed the game and only for a superb Cluxton save it could have been even more damning.
That's right it was a good contest in 2016 and no doubt there was a time when it looked like the game had turned, Donegal got a great team goal and soon after Dublin lost Connolly wasn't it? It looked hairy and a sublime Paul Mannion individual effort put a bit of gloss on the result.
Donegal have done a better job than most and no doubt that was easily the greatest ever Donegal team IMO to ever play the game, I wonder if McGuinness had of got his hands on the senior panel a little sooner could yiz have possibly done even better, but in fairness he was off doing an excellent job with your U21's
You never see many Donegal posters whinge about advantages etc.
You've proven that a county with a much smaller population, less sponsorship, less bloody everything can compete and beat this Dublin team if they are good enough and have the right people in charge and believe they can do it..
But some want to spend their time blaming everything else apart from themselves.
You should be proud and it was a pleasure as a fan going up against that Donegal side. 2011, 2012 I think you'd have beaten Dublin too, 2014 and 2016. There was a great rivalry building there but as you said yourself you've fallen back a bit while Dublin have kept the show going and without doubt that's down to Jim Gavin.
I believe he's the real difference when all is said and done. I dont think there's a better man in the country today or quite possibly ever that could have kept Dublin moving forward like this.
He's the one consistent from his U21 days right up to now and he's learned from his mistakes and that turned Dublin into a team that are so hard to beat even when their backs are against the wall as has happened on several occasions across this decade.
He's the best of the best and given his nature of staying away from the limelight and glory, he's helped to mask our true greatest advantage. Himself.
Beelzedub (Dublin) - Posts: 480 - 09/04/2018 17:33:31
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Replying To MesAmis: "All that silverware in the swag bag makes an awful rattle is right Pat!" Haha very good!
jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20598 - 09/04/2018 17:39:26
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Replying To Royal.Legend: "Of course the dubs can be rattled and rattled they will be, come June the tenth at approximately 5.30 Dublin's dominence of the Leinster championship will be over and the royals will go marching on." That's the spirit!!
But that'll only get you so far..
jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20598 - 09/04/2018 17:40:39
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Replying To TheUsername: " Replying To jimbodub: "Mad isn't it
Able to say anything you want and think it as fact...
Very easy to counter claim every scrap of that Royaldunne.
How can money going into Dublin primary schools over the last 13-14 years create what has happened exactly?
Just a tiny bit of thought rather than convenient ignorance will give you your answer.
Think of the age profiles of the players since 2010. Funding going into primary schools since roughly 2004-2005... haha
It has Zero impact on the vast % of senior Dublin players across that time.
They are too old and long out of primary school when that funding starterd :)
It's not as if funding is pumped directly into the Dublin senior football team. It's just not.
Yep we have private sponsorship, always well funded, didn't mean much before the natural crop of players stated to arrive from around 2010, despite the money, population, playing in Croke Park... Dublin had their worst period in GAA history
So those advantages didn't matter much!! In fact it was a sticker used to best Dublin when they were down.
It's not Yerra Royaldunne
Those games happened across this decade. It's been hugely competitive. It's not like Dublin are mopping up underage titles and winning everything.. that would be a monster and that's not happening.
Underage titles have been hard to come by for Dublin. Especially at minor level across "the monster" period
We've done much better at U21 and guess who was across many of those teams and guided many of the most successful Dub players of all time.. yep. Mr Jim Gavin.
Guess where Dublin's success has been built. It's been built off 2-3 U21 Dublin teams.
The above stats and results are fact. Not baseless and convenient sound bites.
The age profiles of the Dublin players since 2010 without question nullifies the points raised about central funding going to pay coaches helping out primary school children.
But sure that's yerra right?
It takes a little bit of looking beyond your own nose and if you must.. a calculator to work out the age profiles of the players and you'll spot that there was no monster created.
Now there could be in the future... that's when the real impact might be felt but looking at the spread of underage AI titles.. It's not looking very apparent right now." It's an Interesting one, if there was to be a bounce linked to finance and developing players when would it be expected to happen if you took 2005 as the mark. Start of the next decade. Dublin certainly do well out of finance, I think the contribution from the GAA is small fish though, Dublins allocation has actually been cut year on year since 2013 and it's impact is overstated and manipulated. I suspect the real beast, is commercial and merchandising revenue, thats just impossible for anyone to compete with really and always will be. That's the real smoking gun that will only go one way and that's through the roof, I happened to be in one of the Elverys in one of the suburbs today, not traditionally a GAA stronghold more soccer and rugby. Their was racks of Irish soccer and Rugby gear, but people were furiously searching for sizes of Dublin gear which was almost sold out. I was looking for something in particular and asked the girl in the shop, she told me they can't keep the Dublin gear in stock and O Neil's can't keep up with demand around the range. It was really startling in comparison to the soccer and rugby gear in particular, but great to see all the kids and all around Dublin gear and the section was almost sold out. To be fair to Dublin they don't milk it we have had the same jersey for three seasons now. Then the AIG deal is up this year, you would expect that to be significantly better then when it was signed in 2013, given the exposure they have gotten as a result and I expect their will be other companies interested. The thing you have to say is the excellent management of the county board, Dublin have natural advantages certainly when it comes to finance, but it's mansged so well, not just for the men's senior teams but all the Dublin teams seem to receive decent support, I don't believe to the extent that some would have you believe, but the community aspect of the GAA is alive and well in the capital. I think that accounts for better player development then anything if I'm honest and clever structures that I'm sure are being mimicked. As for this era it will be judged at a different point, it's not the time for this Dublin team to reflect, we are still chasing history, it's anout the next game, next challenge. Some will have the opinion that this era hasn't been competitive, others will say that the Dubs saved Galuec football from the "puke football" era of the 00's and the blanket defense. They are debates for the future, hopefully this era for Dublin is a long way off being judged in its finalty."
I don't like much of it myself but there you go winning breeds winning and it's very attractive to kids.
The Dubs could really milk it no doubt and you are right about the next round of sponsorship discussions, I'm sure if Dublin stick with AIG that they'll be looking for more given the improved climate
Yes the time is not right to analysis Dublin's achievements as the process is still ongoing! I guess I just wanted to highlight the games this decade that very much fitted into Pat Spillanea logic.
There will be plenty of more dodgy moments for Dublin this year and all that experience and character will be tested once again.
We can't always be winning the close ones so we'll see what 2018 brings
jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20598 - 09/04/2018 17:47:01
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Replying To AthCliath: "Yes Crokepark is an advantage , Yes having all our players living in the county and not commuting big distances to training compared to the likes of Monaghon , Mayo or Roscommon to name a few is an advantage , this can't be denied . Although Kildare, Meath , Kerry don't have a real issue here.
As regards money of course it helps , better facilities make life easier . Better analysing can be done with the most up to date equipment. But do Kerry want for anything in this area even when it comes to strength conditioning and nutrition they have very well known professional coaches in this area helping out.
Your looking for a reason to explain Dublin's success and can only mention money because then you don't have to face the fact this is an exceptionly good team. Who are well coached and have a real hunger for winning.
If your looking for a reason for this Dublin teams success, It will be seen that the 2011 minor team that lost the All Ireland final to Tipp , who then won u21 All Ireland in 2014 are the main reason beind this , coupled with a manager who wasnt afraid to give youth a chance and is now reaping the benefits.
Jack mc Caffrey, David Byrne, Brian Fenton, Paul Mannion, Eric Lowndes, Cormac Costello, John Small, Niall Scully, Conor mc Hugh. Were all playing u21 team in 2014 , Ciaran Kilkenny was in Australia only for that he would of played.
These lads are integrated with battle hardened lads from 2011 . Who despite having 4 All Ireland's and 5 leagues are still determined to give everything in every game, will put their body on the line in every game . Have never lost the hunger to win and have held their composure many times in nerve racking situations.
Money will get you a lot of things, but it can't buy that ." You'd wonder how they haven't lost the drive given all the success but a large slice of it has to be down to the management.
Even the consistency across NFL Div 1 where you'd expect them to find it a little tougher off the back of a competitive AI win.. 6 finals now on the bounce winning 5/6
There is something special about the drive they have. Winning breeds winning.
jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20598 - 09/04/2018 17:52:00
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Replying To realdub: "It's going to be very tough for Dublin to do it this year. If it is achieved I think it'll have to be done with some new faces. It hard to see us being able to field our 1st 15 this season.
It'll take a monumental effort and not money to make it happen!!" When you think it was Con and Basquel coming off the bench to help Dublin win the game.. there's definitely a transition going on! You had Howard winning key possessions too.. it will def be a new look Dublin team in 2018
Let's see if it'll be good enough
jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20598 - 09/04/2018 18:10:59
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