Meath Forum

Division 2 2018

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Replying To Furlong1949:  "I understand why some supporters have little hope. This has been our worst decade since the 1920s. Since 2001 we have fallen from the top table. Between 2007 and 2010 we again started to climb back up that table. But we have fallen back again. The reason why all this happened is because when Boylan left (and anytime a great manager leaves after decades in charge the team and everything it around it falls to pieces). Just look at Man Utd after Ferguson left. Thats what happened in Meath. At the start of this decade the 07 to 10 team started to break up. While between 2013 and 2017, we were transition as the whole panel had a massive overhaul ,as a set of new young players arrived on the scene. We are now entering a stronger period. But the defeatist atitude that some have is no good for us. We know were we are. We know what problems we have. But the future can be a better place. But some need to have more faith and believe in their county. Understand we are Meath, we are Meath. And that means something. Read the below story and learn what being from Meath really means .

This is Meath football. The below story shows the true spirit of Meath football. If u want to know about the spirit of Meath football read below. I meet people in my county every week from young to old who will say that we will beat the Dubs soon. Yes some of have a defeatest atitude . But there is many in the county from young to old who still believe. Maybe the story below will explain why we always believe we will beat the Dubs someday. Not this year or next year but some day soon

In the summer of 1964 Dublin were the reigning All Ireland champions. A team with St Vincent's player and led by Kevin Heffernan they were seen as unbeatable and were changing the face of football along with Down with new tactics and new training. They were expected to dominate leinster and football for years ( Where have we heard that before ). In the early 60s Meath were in divsion 3 and seen as a county living off former glories. But three brothers the Quinn brothers from a small tiny parish in rural Meath had difference ideas Meath were playing Dublin in the leinster final. Meath were rank outsiders and Dublin the hottest of hot favourites were seen as unbeatable. No one gave Meath a chance.

Behind the scenes the three Quinn brothers father became critically ill and had very little time to live. On the Saturday before the match he became critically ill and it was believed he would not last the night. The local priest annointed him. The brothers didnt know what to do. Would it be appropriate to play the leinster final the next day. They believed it wouldnt. But there father told them on his deathbed, he whispered to them not just to play Dublin but to go out to Croker on Sunday and beat the Dubs. So with all their family uncles and aunts with tears in their eyes they decided that they were going to play and bring back the Delaney Cup to show their sick father. As Jack Quinn said Theres a job to be done lets f#$$//kin do it". Their mothers words left no room for doubt as they left the house the next morning as she said to each one of the brothers as they left the house "Go go Meath Meath'.

They went to the match and the local priest comes into the dressing room before the match and tells the brothers, the father is still alive. The brothers were magnificent in the first half. With Jack putting in an exhibition of high fielding. Unbelievably Meath were ahead at half time. In the dressing room.at the interval the news was passed on to the Quinns that the father was still alive. Meath came out in the second and gave the single greatest performance by a Meath team in leinster final ever. With the three Quinn brothers to the fore Meath dethroned the reigning All Ireland champions by 7 points. In the papers the next day an Irish Press journalist wrote " the Dubs may as well have tried to take a high ball of the top of Nelson pillar as it take it from.Martin and Jack Quinn".

As the cup was lifted the the Quinns received news that their father was still alive. That night the 3 Quinn brother Jack Martin and Gerry brought the Delaney cup back to kilbride to show their ailing father. They say word of the famous victory seemed to revive their fathers spirit. He came around on the Monday and took it all in looking at Delaney cup with pride as their mother read him articles from the newspaper about the match and his 3 sons. As she read about the match one of his last words was " thats fantastic ". It was emotional. And he died on the Wednesday 3 days after the leinster final.

The brothers and Meath would unluckily lose to the great Galway team.in the semi final. In 66 they won leinster and defeated the great Down team by 14 points in a semi final again they lost to the great Galway team in the final. The next year they won Sam. And in 1968 toured Australia and played Auzzie Rules and were unbeaten as they toured and invented the international rules. They would beat Offaly in the greatest leinster final of them all in 1970.
The truth is not only did they dethrone in 64 but they sent Dublin to the football wilderness for ten years as Dublin failed to win the Delaney cup for ten years till Heffos Army emerged in 1974.

And thats Meath football. Just as Mick lyons once said "Id live and die to play the Dubs". Martin Quinn said that when we heard what lyons said he told a local journalist " We all feel that way".
And he is right for many Meath people we all feel that way when it comes to beating Dublin. And the McEntee brothers are another set of great Meath brothers following in the footsteps of the Quinn brothers carrying on that great Meath tradition that is passed from one generation to another from one decade to another from one set of Meath footballers to another. And that is , "its mid July the hay is saved and The Dubs are beaten". A rallying cry for Meath footballers down through the ages."
This is complete nonsense. Faith and belief? will you get a grip. Understand we are meath? This is the problem we have. We have zero right to be at the top table or beat any team. We must work and continue to work like every other team to get and stay there. The reason we have fallen back is not because boylan left. The seniors were on the slide during boylans last years anyway. The reason and flynn alluded to it this week is because we neglected underage for years. No players with minor or 21 all irelands, winning breeds winners at the end of the day. The faith and belief will come when theese lads start winning. Rambling on about past players from the 60s?? we need to forget about past glories and just plough on with developing a consistent underage where we have a conveyor belt of players coming through like Dublin, Tyrone, Kerry. We will get there some day, theres too much passion and interest not to get back there some day but for now its bleak.

as to when we can challenge dublin? not in the next 3 years at least.

edd (Meath) - Posts: 42 - 21/02/2018 18:37:42    2079054

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Replying To edd:  "This is complete nonsense. Faith and belief? will you get a grip. Understand we are meath? This is the problem we have. We have zero right to be at the top table or beat any team. We must work and continue to work like every other team to get and stay there. The reason we have fallen back is not because boylan left. The seniors were on the slide during boylans last years anyway. The reason and flynn alluded to it this week is because we neglected underage for years. No players with minor or 21 all irelands, winning breeds winners at the end of the day. The faith and belief will come when theese lads start winning. Rambling on about past players from the 60s?? we need to forget about past glories and just plough on with developing a consistent underage where we have a conveyor belt of players coming through like Dublin, Tyrone, Kerry. We will get there some day, theres too much passion and interest not to get back there some day but for now its bleak.

as to when we can challenge dublin? not in the next 3 years at least."
All I have to say we are lucky players in the 40s had not your beliefs are we wouldnt have 1 leinster. We were in a worst position then with not 1 All Ireland and Dublin with 15. Its lucky the players and management didnt in the 80s did have your thoughts as we hadnt won a leinster in 16 years and Dublin had won 9 of the previous 12 leinster and reached 9 All.Irelands final in the late 70s early 80s. If Boylan and O Rourke and Lyons and all those great players had your way of thinking we wouldnt have won 1 leinster title in the last 35 years.
We need to be realistic and yes we need to improve our underage. But we will beat Dublin in the coming years its not question if its a question of when. Because the men in charge of our county have the faith the belief and the skills to drive us to victory. People should of course criticize. But a defeatist atitude is totally at odds with our county renowned never say die spirit. It lives on. We will be back. We will do it. Every generation of Meathmen have beaten the Dubs and most of them have dominated the Dubs for years with sucessive victories. The one thing Dublin cannot handle and could never handle is 15 driven commited Meath men fighting fot evetry ball like their life depended on it. It will happen again. Sooner then you think. Have a little faith in your county. Meath leinster Champions 2021.

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 221 - 21/02/2018 20:00:14    2079075

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Replying To Furlong1949:  "All I have to say we are lucky players in the 40s had not your beliefs are we wouldnt have 1 leinster. We were in a worst position then with not 1 All Ireland and Dublin with 15. Its lucky the players and management didnt in the 80s did have your thoughts as we hadnt won a leinster in 16 years and Dublin had won 9 of the previous 12 leinster and reached 9 All.Irelands final in the late 70s early 80s. If Boylan and O Rourke and Lyons and all those great players had your way of thinking we wouldnt have won 1 leinster title in the last 35 years.
We need to be realistic and yes we need to improve our underage. But we will beat Dublin in the coming years its not question if its a question of when. Because the men in charge of our county have the faith the belief and the skills to drive us to victory. People should of course criticize. But a defeatist atitude is totally at odds with our county renowned never say die spirit. It lives on. We will be back. We will do it. Every generation of Meathmen have beaten the Dubs and most of them have dominated the Dubs for years with sucessive victories. The one thing Dublin cannot handle and could never handle is 15 driven commited Meath men fighting fot evetry ball like their life depended on it. It will happen again. Sooner then you think. Have a little faith in your county. Meath leinster Champions 2021."
Great I must book the Monday off!!

grahamc9897 (Meath) - Posts: 860 - 21/02/2018 20:28:00    2079076

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Replying To royaldunne:  "Hello , just want to say you have joined a long list of posters who people have lied about and said you are my good self, you have a great insight into Meath past and I love reading them. Don't be disparaged by people from Kildare, Cavan, or wherever pretending to be from Meath to have a pop of me, from what I recall it was jinxie, ziggy, htaem bobjaffacake, bettustownroyal, Bert, loyalroyal, and more recently grahammc (and since we very seldom agree it was hilariously funny). Keep posting furlong and ignore those who try to put you down, leave them to me, I'll destroy them lol"
Dont mind the begrudgers Royaldunne. I admire your honesty. Your a great supporter and your passion for the county is mighty. Fair play to you.
Also have to say I like reading Jinxie and Ziggy who always have very good anaylsis of Meath games. Three hoganstand legends . Respect.

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 221 - 21/02/2018 21:28:48    2079088

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Replying To Furlong1949:  "Thanks for the invitation to Ballinbrackey RoyalDunne. Always admired Ballinbrackeys Chris O Connor. I thought he was one of the best defenders in the county but was let go to soon. I also thought Damien Carroll was let go to soon also. He gave two man of the match performances v kildare in Croker. He didnt follow up with consistency but I still think he had allot to offer. Because of the changing of managers 7 in 12 years we did lose players that still had alot to offer. New manager comes in with new ideas and new players. It definatly halted the development of our team and players. Im thinking of players let go that had allot to offer like the two mentioned above and others like Niall McLoughlin Alan Nestor Cormac McGuiness and Cian Ward and many more."
Absolutely agree, the decision to drop juicy was totally bizarre. Also Damian should have been used more as a link man than he was.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 12707 - 21/02/2018 22:08:27    2079094

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Is there anything to be said for saying another mass?

Jinxie (Meath) - Posts: 6093 - 21/02/2018 22:30:58    2079102

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Replying To Jinxie:  "Is there anything to be said for saying another mass?"
Classic...

grahamc9897 (Meath) - Posts: 860 - 22/02/2018 01:19:36    2079127

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Replying To Furlong1949:  "All I have to say we are lucky players in the 40s had not your beliefs are we wouldnt have 1 leinster. We were in a worst position then with not 1 All Ireland and Dublin with 15. Its lucky the players and management didnt in the 80s did have your thoughts as we hadnt won a leinster in 16 years and Dublin had won 9 of the previous 12 leinster and reached 9 All.Irelands final in the late 70s early 80s. If Boylan and O Rourke and Lyons and all those great players had your way of thinking we wouldnt have won 1 leinster title in the last 35 years.
We need to be realistic and yes we need to improve our underage. But we will beat Dublin in the coming years its not question if its a question of when. Because the men in charge of our county have the faith the belief and the skills to drive us to victory. People should of course criticize. But a defeatist atitude is totally at odds with our county renowned never say die spirit. It lives on. We will be back. We will do it. Every generation of Meathmen have beaten the Dubs and most of them have dominated the Dubs for years with sucessive victories. The one thing Dublin cannot handle and could never handle is 15 driven commited Meath men fighting fot evetry ball like their life depended on it. It will happen again. Sooner then you think. Have a little faith in your county. Meath leinster Champions 2021."
I think your missing the point he was making Furlong1949, no county HAS A RIGHT or DESERVES to be at the top of the pile based solely on their counties history or past glories. Meath have slid down the pecking order because of this attitude and ignoring the underage teams and 'production line' or 'conveyor belt' of players that we should have been producing down through the years. He said that if we plough on with the hard work going into our underage teams (which has shown positive results already against the dubs) and also keep working with the seniors then it wont be long before we are back at the top and beating the best teams again......but that won't just automatically happen because 'We are Meath', it will happen when we put in enough work at all levels to have earned a place back at the top table.

Everyone here WANTS Meath to be back challenging for All Irelands and Leinsters, but some people seem to think we are entitled to be there because of who we are/were and others (myself included) believe that we have to work towards it and earn that chance (and if we continue on the route we are going at the moment we will be, hopefully in the next 3-5 years at provincial level anyway)

ratlag (Meath) - Posts: 230 - 22/02/2018 10:18:02    2079160

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Replying To Furlong1949:  "Dont mind the begrudgers Royaldunne. I admire your honesty. Your a great supporter and your passion for the county is mighty. Fair play to you.
Also have to say I like reading Jinxie and Ziggy who always have very good anaylsis of Meath games. Three hoganstand legends . Respect."
Furlong I would put Htaem in to that category as well.

OLLIE (Louth) - Posts: 11225 - 22/02/2018 13:08:27    2079196

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Replying To OLLIE:  "Furlong I would put Htaem in to that category as well."
I agree Ollie like yourself Htaem is an excellent contributer also. Very good anaylsis also. Always worth reading.

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 221 - 22/02/2018 15:01:32    2079225

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Replying To ratlag:  "I think your missing the point he was making Furlong1949, no county HAS A RIGHT or DESERVES to be at the top of the pile based solely on their counties history or past glories. Meath have slid down the pecking order because of this attitude and ignoring the underage teams and 'production line' or 'conveyor belt' of players that we should have been producing down through the years. He said that if we plough on with the hard work going into our underage teams (which has shown positive results already against the dubs) and also keep working with the seniors then it wont be long before we are back at the top and beating the best teams again......but that won't just automatically happen because 'We are Meath', it will happen when we put in enough work at all levels to have earned a place back at the top table.

Everyone here WANTS Meath to be back challenging for All Irelands and Leinsters, but some people seem to think we are entitled to be there because of who we are/were and others (myself included) believe that we have to work towards it and earn that chance (and if we continue on the route we are going at the moment we will be, hopefully in the next 3-5 years at provincial level anyway)"
I know . No one is entitled to anything. You have to go out there and earn it. I know our underage record has to improve. Our record at underage recenlty with the exception of 2012 has been very poor. I know we need to improve and have to improve. Our record at under 21 level is apalling. Not 1 Under 21 leinster titles in 16 years. No All Ireland titles in 16 years. Its linked. No leinster u21 titles in 16 years 1 leinster senior title in 16 years its linked. Its no coincidence that counties like Cavan Kildare and Roscommon Galway who all got promoted before us to div 1 all have had numerous provincial sucesses at under 21 level. Hopefully the new under 20 and under 17 grade will suit us. If we dont turn the hard work been done at underage level in recent years into silverware at underage level, questions need to be asked. I have been hugely critical of our lack of sucess at under 21 especially.

I know we cannot just rely on our tradition. Its not going to win us anything in the present or future. The comment I said about We are Meath has being jumped on. Let me explain. When Cork were playing Clare in 1999 hurling munster final. Clare one of my favorite teams ever in any sport. Had given Cork a terrible couple of years. As the players stood to go onto thr pitch. 2 or 3 of the young Cork fellas just 21 start roaring "we are Cork we are Cork". Anthony Daly said at the time he thought they were crazy. Mad stuff altogether. It was arrogant brash and very cocky for those Cork lads to be shouting this. They had no right. Seen as Clare had hammered Cork in the last few years. But Clare had never beaten Cork in a munster final. And against the odds , Cork defeated that great Clare team and won liam that year.

That story always stood with me. Yes it was arrogant by those young Cork hurlers. But what they were saying was that being a Cork hurler meant something you were carrying on a great tradition. You were standing on the shoulders of gaints. You had responsiblty to the jersey you were playing. It didnt help them win. But it was another weapon in their asrenal. Anything that give you an edge on an opponent you should take it.

I have alway felt our strenght is our greatest weakness as well as being our greatest strenght. We think we are better then Westmeath or kildare or laois or Limerick or Wexford. When we are weak we are not. All those counties have beaten us in recent years. But when we are strong we have no inferior complex. We seem to up our games v the top teams.

Take Galway and kildare this year. Why have Galway won 3 matchs and kildare lost 3 in div 1. There's not much between both teams. The difference is Galway believe they belong in div 1. They have no inferior complex. Coming from their tradition. Kildare dont have the same mentality. It doesnt win you anything. But it can be a help when a team is strong. Look at Mayo. This Mayo team are clearly good enough to win an All Ireland. They should have won 1 in the last two years. The weight of history is a massive problem for them
No team in gaelic football has closed a 50 year gap between winning an All Irelands. Dublin have a tradition of winning All Irelands. They dont have that weight of history. Even though GAA is more sport science and fitness and stats and GPS , tradition still has played role in Mayo not winning Sam. Im not saying its the main reason. Im just saying its another factor. That cannot be ruled out.

I think there is a generation thing going on here. Lads that have started Meath in last 10 to 15 years or a bit more pessimistic. While fans from the 80s and 90s are less so. Listen I know fans from 80s and 90s who are pessimistic while fans from the last ten years are more optimistic. But I do think there could be more pessimism agmost the recent supporters. I could be wrong. So dont qoute me on that. It just a hunch. But for me that I have seen Meath men do such extraordinary achievements in Croke Park , it makes me never give up. I was there for the 4 games in 91. Something like that lives with you forever. It was not just a great sport occasion but also a lesson for life, never give up.

I know we need not to stay in the past. It wouldnt win us anything . Kick one ball.over the bar. It gives us the entitlement to nothing. It means feck all on saturday or next week or the week after. But it part of who we are. Its better to have it then not have it. And in the bigger picture honestly it is an help an assistance, another something we can use for our advantage. Dont live in the past, dont glorify the past but use it as another weapon in your asrenal and honour the jersey with performances that it dererves. Onwards and upwards. Sucess at underage level will be the key to sucess. But past achievements will be there in the background showing our younger teams this is what you need to do, showing them route the way to sucess. This is where you come from. You have responsibility to the jersey and the traditions of that jersey. Now make your own traditions make your own history by being brave skilful and looking forward but also taking a little inspiration from the past. Use whatever is at your disposal to win. Its all about the fine margins. Theres a thin line between sucess and failure. Use whatever you can to be a sucess.

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 221 - 22/02/2018 15:47:23    2079234

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Replying To Jinxie:  "Is there anything to be said for saying another mass?"
God I love a good mass

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 12707 - 22/02/2018 18:40:15    2079298

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