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Replying To ratlag: "Not sure where Menton at 6 is coming from by a few people??? Not that I don't he wouldn't do well there but he rarely ever played there, his best half back position is on the wing as he is a powerful ball carrier and is also fit enough to get up and down the pitch, putting him at 6 where he has to hold the position and not wander takes away from his better attributes in my opinion" A lot of our players are not playing in their best positions which is part of the problem . However Menton is probably as good a midfielder as we have available so we need him in that position. We have to win the midfield and Andy has to make that area of the pitch the must win battleground no matter how many players it takes to do it. Win the midfield and it protects our backs and gives our forwards plenty of opportunity.
Poormouth (Meath) - Posts: 204 - 22/06/2017 17:55:04
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Replying To ratlag: "Not sure where Menton at 6 is coming from by a few people??? Not that I don't he wouldn't do well there but he rarely ever played there, his best half back position is on the wing as he is a powerful ball carrier and is also fit enough to get up and down the pitch, putting him at 6 where he has to hold the position and not wander takes away from his better attributes in my opinion" Menton got marked out of it last week in the first half, he did get a couple of points but he is not a midfielder. He is also slower then a Wing back should be. we need to tighten up in the middle of our backline as Kildare went down the middle all day. I cant think of a player who is as big as Menton and that has played for Meath that long. Shipping 5 goals in 2 games but we still play nearly all positions 1-8 in the wrong positions,
SheridansTry (Meath) - Posts: 180 - 22/06/2017 18:08:01
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Replying To Htaem: "Be interesting to see how we regroup on Saturday week, one thing's for sure, we can't go into the game assuming victory just because we're playing a div3 team at home, we just don't have the form to back up such confidence.
The game v Kildare was a washout, it's frightening to watch back, we were completely destroyed, it was never a contest. I just hope this hasn't effected the players confidence too much, I hope they're bursting to get back out on the field and restore some pride." When was the last time we won a qualifier game? I don't think micko won one, we got beat by Laois in banty last year, did we win on in his first year? Or is it further back??
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 22/06/2017 20:02:39
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Replying To royaldunne: "When was the last time we won a qualifier game? I don't think micko won one, we got beat by Laois in banty last year, did we win on in his first year? Or is it further back??" we beat louth in cavan in his first year 2012 last win then lost to Kildare in navan. 2013 one game lost to Tyrone by two points. 2014 one game lost to Armagh by four points 2015 one game lost to Tyrone three points and last year one game lost to Derry
meath1977 (Meath) - Posts: 534 - 22/06/2017 20:18:31
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Replying To royaldunne: "When was the last time we won a qualifier game? I don't think micko won one, we got beat by Laois in banty last year, did we win on in his first year? Or is it further back??" As far as I remember the last qualifier game we won was v Galway back in 2011, it's a pretty dire record and one which we should be looking to put to bed immediately.
Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 22/06/2017 20:28:20
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Replying To royaldunne: "When was the last time we won a qualifier game? I don't think micko won one, we got beat by Laois in banty last year, did we win on in his first year? Or is it further back??" 2011 was the last time we won a qualifier that was vs Galway I think it was in portlaoise .we beat Louth in Breffeni the week before that, that was the 4 goals by Cian Ward game
SheridansTry (Meath) - Posts: 180 - 22/06/2017 20:32:09
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Replying To royaldunne: "When was the last time we won a qualifier game? I don't think micko won one, we got beat by Laois in banty last year, did we win on in his first year? Or is it further back??" MOD was always very unlucky with the qualifier draws, 4 Ulster teams (Tyrone X2). Should be an easy win ala Louth. If we can't beat Sligo at home we might as well go down to the Nicky Rackard!
pauk123 (USA) - Posts: 189 - 22/06/2017 20:41:31
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Right before the Kildare game there was signs of progress stability even. But for me it has to be all ripped up. That Kildare game has go down as one Meath's humiliating defeats after the drubbing they got in Navan. And watching the Kildare subs laughing and joking on the bench summed how bad it was when they afford a laugh and joke with 10 minutes to go. I expected more that what they served up Last Saturday night. All the old failings no clear game plan, Players not performing on the big occasion (Biggy been the most disappointing) our defense has porous to say the least. 5 or 6 players could be dropped and not a one could complain. Where dose a manger begin to pick that team up re group for Sligo ? I sure he will. But I cant see us going to far beyond that this year unless a miracle. I hope am wrong.
bobkarlgees (Meath) - Posts: 1263 - 22/06/2017 20:43:15
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Replying To pauk123: "MOD was always very unlucky with the qualifier draws, 4 Ulster teams (Tyrone X2). Should be an easy win ala Louth. If we can't beat Sligo at home we might as well go down to the Nicky Rackard!" very unlucky all right Armagh and Derry they are big hitters all right real top teams. Dublin in 2014 lost my 16 points very unlucky all right . West meath ten points up very unlucky all right
meath1977 (Meath) - Posts: 534 - 22/06/2017 20:55:48
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Replying To bobkarlgees: "Right before the Kildare game there was signs of progress stability even. But for me it has to be all ripped up. That Kildare game has go down as one Meath's humiliating defeats after the drubbing they got in Navan. And watching the Kildare subs laughing and joking on the bench summed how bad it was when they afford a laugh and joke with 10 minutes to go. I expected more that what they served up Last Saturday night. All the old failings no clear game plan, Players not performing on the big occasion (Biggy been the most disappointing) our defense has porous to say the least. 5 or 6 players could be dropped and not a one could complain. Where dose a manger begin to pick that team up re group for Sligo ? I sure he will. But I cant see us going to far beyond that this year unless a miracle. I hope am wrong." The Kildare game was undoubtedly a calamity for us, in fairness we did show good progress from after the Down game in the league but last Saturday brought us crashing back to Earth with a bang.
For me now, optimism is suspended but I'm not turning to pessimism either, let's just wait and see what happens. I honestly don't think we're as bad as we performed against Kildare, but how good are we? well that I know.
Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 22/06/2017 20:57:37
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Replying To meath1977: "we beat louth in cavan in his first year 2012 last win then lost to Kildare in navan. 2013 one game lost to Tyrone by two points. 2014 one game lost to Armagh by four points 2015 one game lost to Tyrone three points and last year one game lost to Derry" That was actually 2011 v louth. Followed a week later by a good game in navan v Galway with a huge crowd. Then kildare a cuple of weeks later beat us.
Jinxie (Meath) - Posts: 6342 - 22/06/2017 21:14:56
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Replying To meath1977: "very unlucky all right Armagh and Derry they are big hitters all right real top teams. Dublin in 2014 lost my 16 points very unlucky all right . West meath ten points up very unlucky all right" Armagh and Derry were at the time (and still are) significantly better than Sligo. This is the best draw we have gotten in years, you couldn't have hand picked a better draw.
pauk123 (USA) - Posts: 189 - 22/06/2017 22:02:25
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Replying To Jinxie: "That was actually 2011 v louth. Followed a week later by a good game in navan v Galway with a huge crowd. Then kildare a cuple of weeks later beat us." spot on.
ziggy32001 (Meath) - Posts: 8354 - 22/06/2017 22:03:30
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Replying To pauk123: "Armagh and Derry were at the time (and still are) significantly better than Sligo. This is the best draw we have gotten in years, you couldn't have hand picked a better draw." yes it is a good draw but micko was not unlucky . nice guy and all but he got his four years he just was not up for the job. he got his brush and cleared eight or nine players and replaced them with light small fast players who are still there today and have not proven themselves as inter county players . some of the players he dropped are still our top club players
meath1977 (Meath) - Posts: 534 - 22/06/2017 22:14:21
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My take on the last game was this. First of all there was a game plan, it was the same game plan as the Louth game. Anyone watching that game knew exactly what we were going to do and how to counteract it i.e. cut off the routes for Biggy and Cillian to run. Especially since we picked the same team again.
Saying that Graham didn't perform seems to ignore the fact that Kildare were focused on neutralising him. When a game plan doesn't work it's up to the players to find a different way to win. The management can't do much once the ball is thrown in but perhaps we should have had a plan b. Although I'm sure Andy wanted us to impose our game on them but he wouldn't have anticipated how much fitter and stronger Kildare were. Also Kildares tackling was superb. How long do you give it till abandon your game plan. You want to have faith in your players to influence the game.
One analysis on the42.ie shows how our forwards and half forwards didn't put enough pressure on them when they got the ball. Also we had to get more of our guys attacking the breaking ball off the kick outs. This was something Mick O'Dowd failed to sort out and its was still there quite a bit last week. Having said that, our kick out execution simply wasn't good enough to begin with.
Going forward we need a clear idea of what to do if they try shut down Graham and Cillian from running. We need our forwards putting on more pressure when not in possession that might stop such dangerous ball going into our backs.
LoyalRoyal (None) - Posts: 452 - 22/06/2017 23:43:33
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Replying To pauk123: "Armagh and Derry were at the time (and still are) significantly better than Sligo. This is the best draw we have gotten in years, you couldn't have hand picked a better draw." i would prefer to play armagh or derry tbh...
ziggy32001 (Meath) - Posts: 8354 - 23/06/2017 08:28:02
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Replying To meath1977: "yes it is a good draw but micko was not unlucky . nice guy and all but he got his four years he just was not up for the job. he got his brush and cleared eight or nine players and replaced them with light small fast players who are still there today and have not proven themselves as inter county players . some of the players he dropped are still our top club players" Name the players he dropped who are still top club players? Have any of them returned to the fold? If not, why hasn't Andy brought them back?
Ratoath Royal (Meath) - Posts: 1362 - 23/06/2017 08:56:00
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Replying To LoyalRoyal: "My take on the last game was this. First of all there was a game plan, it was the same game plan as the Louth game. Anyone watching that game knew exactly what we were going to do and how to counteract it i.e. cut off the routes for Biggy and Cillian to run. Especially since we picked the same team again.
Saying that Graham didn't perform seems to ignore the fact that Kildare were focused on neutralising him. When a game plan doesn't work it's up to the players to find a different way to win. The management can't do much once the ball is thrown in but perhaps we should have had a plan b. Although I'm sure Andy wanted us to impose our game on them but he wouldn't have anticipated how much fitter and stronger Kildare were. Also Kildares tackling was superb. How long do you give it till abandon your game plan. You want to have faith in your players to influence the game.
One analysis on the42.ie shows how our forwards and half forwards didn't put enough pressure on them when they got the ball. Also we had to get more of our guys attacking the breaking ball off the kick outs. This was something Mick O'Dowd failed to sort out and its was still there quite a bit last week. Having said that, our kick out execution simply wasn't good enough to begin with.
Going forward we need a clear idea of what to do if they try shut down Graham and Cillian from running. We need our forwards putting on more pressure when not in possession that might stop such dangerous ball going into our backs." Loyalroyal , I am as much a believer in Meaths inherent desire to sit at the top table , unfortunately I have to point out that you make a very valid but incorrect point. The valid part of your thread is that the Meath Team did set up to play the same way as they were set up to play against Louth . And as seen by many Louth were not at the races , though they did highlight a worrying weakness ( Goals / Defence) . That point is valid . The incorrect part of your thread is as following . Meath Set up right from the kick out -midfield - forward lines to play as they did against Louth, unfortunately for us , it was against a well coached , drilled Kildare team , whose focus was on Neutralising ,Graham Reilly in attack , been to the ball first against Bryan McMahon , or at least contesting it , and dominating Mid field , and causing pure mayhem in the Meath defence . Which they executed to the nth degree. these areas were the main area of focus. and if you analyse C O Sullivans impact you will note that in general for all the opportunities he creates or gets he tends to only convert around 1-4 , so it appears that they did not overtly worry about Cillian,taken that they had already focussed on dominating M/F .
The problem I have with your post is that you state that , once the guys are on the pitch , the management could not do anything about the way Kildare had set up to play them ..... One statement here , Any Management team worth their salt would have a plan B or C to try negate neutralisation of core players. However from POR kick outs to the way there was a lack of movement and support play up front , and thus I conclude that the idea of a plan B or C was foreign to the Meath team against Kildare . We reverted to the primal , individual football ( COS) , because we didn't know what to do , as we didn't have a plan B or C for the team . That is the job of the Management Team to ensure that there is one , and that it has been practised . One of the simplest way to do that is in a practise condition game situation where for all purposes you rest the core players ( take them out ) . and formulate a game plan for when they are not available ...... It should have been planned , but I do not think it was , unfortunately , hopefully we will have the Qualifiers to plan a B or C strategy going forward , and we wont revert to primal player instincts .....
Meath_True (Meath) - Posts: 285 - 23/06/2017 09:14:30
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Replying To Meath_True: "Loyalroyal , I am as much a believer in Meaths inherent desire to sit at the top table , unfortunately I have to point out that you make a very valid but incorrect point. The valid part of your thread is that the Meath Team did set up to play the same way as they were set up to play against Louth . And as seen by many Louth were not at the races , though they did highlight a worrying weakness ( Goals / Defence) . That point is valid . The incorrect part of your thread is as following . Meath Set up right from the kick out -midfield - forward lines to play as they did against Louth, unfortunately for us , it was against a well coached , drilled Kildare team , whose focus was on Neutralising ,Graham Reilly in attack , been to the ball first against Bryan McMahon , or at least contesting it , and dominating Mid field , and causing pure mayhem in the Meath defence . Which they executed to the nth degree. these areas were the main area of focus. and if you analyse C O Sullivans impact you will note that in general for all the opportunities he creates or gets he tends to only convert around 1-4 , so it appears that they did not overtly worry about Cillian,taken that they had already focussed on dominating M/F .
The problem I have with your post is that you state that , once the guys are on the pitch , the management could not do anything about the way Kildare had set up to play them ..... One statement here , Any Management team worth their salt would have a plan B or C to try negate neutralisation of core players. However from POR kick outs to the way there was a lack of movement and support play up front , and thus I conclude that the idea of a plan B or C was foreign to the Meath team against Kildare . We reverted to the primal , individual football ( COS) , because we didn't know what to do , as we didn't have a plan B or C for the team . That is the job of the Management Team to ensure that there is one , and that it has been practised . One of the simplest way to do that is in a practise condition game situation where for all purposes you rest the core players ( take them out ) . and formulate a game plan for when they are not available ...... It should have been planned , but I do not think it was , unfortunately , hopefully we will have the Qualifiers to plan a B or C strategy going forward , and we wont revert to primal player instincts ....." Plus , anyway we are either very naïve , or plain St**** to think that they would not target our go to players . So the B 7 C plan should have been a must
Meath_True (Meath) - Posts: 285 - 23/06/2017 09:22:16
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Replying To Meath_True: "Loyalroyal , I am as much a believer in Meaths inherent desire to sit at the top table , unfortunately I have to point out that you make a very valid but incorrect point. The valid part of your thread is that the Meath Team did set up to play the same way as they were set up to play against Louth . And as seen by many Louth were not at the races , though they did highlight a worrying weakness ( Goals / Defence) . That point is valid . The incorrect part of your thread is as following . Meath Set up right from the kick out -midfield - forward lines to play as they did against Louth, unfortunately for us , it was against a well coached , drilled Kildare team , whose focus was on Neutralising ,Graham Reilly in attack , been to the ball first against Bryan McMahon , or at least contesting it , and dominating Mid field , and causing pure mayhem in the Meath defence . Which they executed to the nth degree. these areas were the main area of focus. and if you analyse C O Sullivans impact you will note that in general for all the opportunities he creates or gets he tends to only convert around 1-4 , so it appears that they did not overtly worry about Cillian,taken that they had already focussed on dominating M/F .
The problem I have with your post is that you state that , once the guys are on the pitch , the management could not do anything about the way Kildare had set up to play them ..... One statement here , Any Management team worth their salt would have a plan B or C to try negate neutralisation of core players. However from POR kick outs to the way there was a lack of movement and support play up front , and thus I conclude that the idea of a plan B or C was foreign to the Meath team against Kildare . We reverted to the primal , individual football ( COS) , because we didn't know what to do , as we didn't have a plan B or C for the team . That is the job of the Management Team to ensure that there is one , and that it has been practised . One of the simplest way to do that is in a practise condition game situation where for all purposes you rest the core players ( take them out ) . and formulate a game plan for when they are not available ...... It should have been planned , but I do not think it was , unfortunately , hopefully we will have the Qualifiers to plan a B or C strategy going forward , and we wont revert to primal player instincts ....." A lot of our old problems surfaced last week (as they did from time to time during league). Many should have been sorted by now, especially kickout strategy both our own and theirs. We have to focus on aspects of game under our control and build from there.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2136 - 23/06/2017 10:00:01
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