Carlow Forum

It Starts Again (Club Hurling)

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Do you ever have anything constructive to offer Aragorn. If youre not condemning your own management, youre knocking the co. board for trying to eliminate thuggery in our games.

pennypincher (Carlow) - Posts: 777 - 01/12/2011 10:40:53    1078357

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well dont to mlr on winning the leinster title, i am sure it is a great boost for carlow hurling, shows what can happen if work is put in at ground level, it is good to see so called weaker counties improving, best of luck in the semi final and hopefully ye will be playing effin in the final

Kenlim (Limerick) - Posts: 864 - 01/12/2011 14:05:08    1078456

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Thanks for that Kenlim, it couldn't have come at a better time.

supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 1987 - 01/12/2011 14:12:58    1078468

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So pennypincher the lads that played in the county final are thugs now are they. I happen to think that these things happen and they have to be dealt with in a fair manner, that's all. Fining the club 4k is crazy stuff and out of proportion to what happened on the day. Going over the top with a whopping fine is not the way to deal with the issue.

aragorn1 (Carlow) - Posts: 156 - 01/12/2011 14:17:12    1078474

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Croke Park have now said that all the club semi's will be at neutral venues now so looks like we now wont have to travel to London!!Looking forward to it.

fergie (Carlow) - Posts: 1082 - 01/12/2011 14:49:54    1078499

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parnell park maybe?

old yellar (None) - Posts: 2601 - 01/12/2011 15:03:36    1078515

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before i start- 1. i do agree that the scenes were unacceptable and do need to be dealt with in some way 2. i dont want to see players punished - but i say so in the context of my arguement that if the clubs are fined 8 grand, how come players escape?! 3. i would generally see the good work done at board level but wholeheartedly disagree here
On the ref issue, as in between the first day and replay. well i thought both refs had good games. i dont think that david hughes did anything but try let the ga,e go and be fair to both sides. i hold my hand up as beforehand i thought he would maybe be way too fussy and blow up everything, but far from it. i think both clubs and sets of players would agree he did a very good job. there was no niggle in either game apart from the big brawl. no major hit went really un dealt with in either. i ve the free count for the drawn game at home and i ll post it up later, but it was low for both sides. so in my eyes the ref the first day had no questions to answer aragon. he is an intercounty ref after all, so he must do something right! The Eire Og incident was harmless by comparison. Much more was made of that situation by members of the media who are constantly lookiing for such stories. I dont think that comparisons should really be made when looking at these incidents.... both these instances involved the alleged interference with an offical. Now this is harmless and the media blew it out of proportion? i think its a worse example to kids to see these scenes. whatever about disrespect for your opponent but for the officials.. well to me thats worse. will mlr/n eoin be charged with having no control over there players and allowing the brawl? whats the difference here? i wonder if this was a game in the mcgrath park in the lge stages with no video, would we have got the same end result?? i was at a game in there a few years back (better keep details to minimum but i msure lads will rem!) when a brawl broke out and it saw subs enter the field and get involved (one of which was a prominent club official!) and i dont recall any fines etc. i still cant get over the idea of huge fines yet no players getting so much as a 4 week ban. maybe i m not upto date on the technicalities of the refs report. but to an outsider it must baffle them! we see these things of late in other counties and those invovlved gots bans etc. or is this just a money making excercise? why not ask the club to forfeit all lge home games for 2 years or something like this along with a moderate fine. as for withdrawing player services.. well i think this is the wrong road to go down. where does this end? the fine impacts the whole adult club from lads playing u18, u21, junior etc. so do you ask your minors not to attend county panels? both clubs had minors/u21s in there senior panels this year. v hard for a club to ask a lad not to play for his county as its a savage honour and it doesnt last forever. this is too much like a stand off. carlow would loose at least half its potential panel, possibly be relegated and be back where we were a few years ago. it then takes another year or 2 to get upto speed and it creates division amongst players. the clubs need to look at other routes to solve this. if all clubs stood together on it from the hurling side and said we withdraw, well then you have unity. again the nuclear option. same with the championship thing. it hurts the club more to miss a year and carlow hurling too.

old yellar (None) - Posts: 2601 - 01/12/2011 15:14:43    1078526

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thugs? i know a lot of these lads personally and i couldnt say that about them. some of the nicest men you would meet anyway, on and off the pitch. what the give for their clubs and county is possibly lost on us all. i was lucky enough to see both camps after the final whistle the second day. the emotions were high on both sides still but the all shook hands (well nearly all!) and left what was on the pitch on the pitch. you can talk about handbags, or helmets being pulled off - its easy do, but was it that bad? wrong, unacceptable, yes. 8 grand and no players sanctioned?? no and baffling! i think we all agree it wasnt a good sight to mark the county final day. was it planned to start? hard to know! but if you are down on the pitch, your geed up, its county final day and a lad gives you a dig in the ribs, well you re unlikely to tap him on the shoulder and say go easy now boss, this is how a row starts! i hope both clubs appeal it and get it reduced, not dismissed. i think after the carlow people/nationalist came out the following tuesday, we all had it well thrashed out and dealt with, so maybe the county board should have left it there too..
sorry for being all over the place! 4000 charactors is max!

old yellar (None) - Posts: 2601 - 01/12/2011 15:15:36    1078527

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Ah Lads Ah Lads Ah Lads.
Right here is what happened before the game, there was shouldering going on, not a prob.
There was helmets pulled off fine yellow card.
there was one punch thrown that was it.
Get over it, it was men against men.
It was not an under 12 match
it was a county senior hurling final with men playing.
polish it whatever way ye want not one player was injured in the handbags
it was man to man stuff 2 teams after training all year to win the holy grail.

Sportie (Carlow) - Posts: 44 - 01/12/2011 15:58:31    1078558

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Neither the Rangers or Myshall players are thugs.... lets get that right. Nobody can claim that.

Secondly both David Hughes and Paud O'Dwyer did a very good job on the games themselves. To claim that David Hughes did a poor job and that the Rangers changed their attitude to the replay based on Hughes refereeing of the drawn game is a long way off I believe. Have you any direct evidenrce aragorn that Rangers did change their attitude to the game based on Hughes refereeing?

Yellar.. I was there at the Eire Og game when Sean Kelly of Rathvilly was 'assaulted' by a person who climbed throught the wire. I saw what happened and I wonder were you there? Whether you were or not is not important but for the sake of accuracy, a lot of people were egging on a well known lady who is a local character saying that the ref was against Eire Og. There was a small hole in the wire and spectators made it bigger for this lady to get through. She got through and picked up a sideline flag. She trotted inot the ref. He did not see her. He turned into the flag that she had raised and the flag hit him in the side of the face. In my view he made a huge deal out of the situation. So to compare what happened at the start of the replayed final and what happened in that Eire Og game is not to compare like with like. I presume that is the incident that you are talking about or is it the replay in Limerick...?

I agree with you that there is a problem when clubs have been severely fined and the players that are guilty of illdiscipline get away scot free. What does that tell you? The officiating on the day was not up to standard when it should have... at the start of the game. The referee who went on to have an excellent game in the match proper did not act as he should have at the start of the game. As a result the county officers - some of them - felt that they were left with no option but to fine the clubs as the referee did not act as he should have.

Are the fines fair? In the view of many they are going to be seen as grossly unfair. However as I have pointed out already, what will the Board do when there is an appeal? Will they reduce them to a level that makes a mockery of the original illdiscipline.... thus legitimising the actual illdiscipline in the first place.

The point I feel needs to be made is that the fine should be such that it hurts and acts as a deterrent for players and clubs in the future as no club and certainly our county does not want a return to such behaviour.

Does this mean that hurling is not a mans game anymore? Certainly not... players can hit hard and fair... no player has ever had a problem with that. Its when a player or a club goes over the boundary of what is acceptable, then the player and or the club should be punished... I think we would all accept that.

I agree with you yellar in that there is no comparison when an official is struck as has happened with Palatine a few years back and what happened in the replayed game. There is no comparison here and I think that no mercy should be shown if an official has been intimidated abused or assaulted. This has happened in Carlow before and the County Board were tough on the people involved. That is as it should be.

As for Rangers or Myshall boycotting the county teams... this is childish and would be a retrograde step as yellar has pointed out.

carlowman (Carlow) - Posts: 1508 - 01/12/2011 19:06:13    1078712

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the case i had in mind is a lot more recent than that one you refer too. maybe you are forgetting it.. i know that case well. went to school and sat beside that ladys nephew for a long many years. her brother lived not a mile from me. that was a thing of nothing in ways..

old yellar (None) - Posts: 2601 - 01/12/2011 19:54:50    1078751

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Kenlim, they ll be playin effin alright but effin who.

pennypincher (Carlow) - Posts: 777 - 01/12/2011 19:59:21    1078756

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yellar... I must be doting... what 'incident' are you referring to? A few hints and I should remember...

carlowman (Carlow) - Posts: 1508 - 01/12/2011 21:14:09    1078822

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last eire og player to get a lengthy ban..

old yellar (None) - Posts: 2601 - 01/12/2011 21:59:26    1078854

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Sorry bout that. couldnt resist.

pennypincher (Carlow) - Posts: 777 - 02/12/2011 10:16:37    1078891

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Yes yellar I wasnt at that game but know the lady and also know tat she was used by a group of idiots so they could have a good laugh at her expense. real gentlemen no doubt. In faairness to ref. he wouldnt have been aware of background and his reaction may have been OTT. Your point bout no players being banned is well made but if the ref. didnt mention it in his report i think their hands are tied, esp. in the absense of video evidence,which they requested but it was not forthcoming.....hence ban.

pennypincher (Carlow) - Posts: 777 - 02/12/2011 10:32:54    1078902

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typical of county board in all fairness like to punisgh teams to this extent. It was a county final players are pumped up wanting to win at all costs how many times has this happened in matches its just pure emotion no player wanting to take a backward step not give an inch lose the first battle. Paud o Dwyer done a great job to get the game going again as well as he did handbags is what it was. In his defence its not the way you want your first county final to go an all in brawl in first minute of game handled really well i think. But for county board to hand out a fine of this size in this day and age is OTT. Maybe they need something improved in dr.cullen at the mo this there way to get it done for nothing. At the end of the day hurling is the last mans game left at the mo and if they start to take this kind of stuff away from it then the game is going to die and die quickly..

ITSCHOLAR (Carlow) - Posts: 228 - 02/12/2011 11:13:12    1078924

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agh.. i think i know now why brendan was in the dock!

old yellar (None) - Posts: 2601 - 02/12/2011 12:06:39    1078957

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Pennypincher

West Tipp's finest 'Effin' Eddie is down to do the commentary. A quick sample below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOS-XQ0oZYM.

If it's it's anything like this it'll be a cracker

Passer_By (Carlow) - Posts: 460 - 03/12/2011 11:02:36    1079356

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Thanks for that Passer-by, classic stuff alright.

pennypincher (Carlow) - Posts: 777 - 03/12/2011 12:12:17    1079375

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